Fit Finlay Addresses Fans Criticizing Divas, Specifically Former Models

Former WWE star and agent to the Divas division, Fit Finlay, has addressed the criticism lobbied towards the WWE Divas, specifically the former models who have been signed by WWE.

Finlay told the website IMetaWrestler.com: “I do think it’s unfair. I’ve had a great relationship with all the girls, we’ve trusted each other and I taught them quite a bit, and it was a real privilege for me to work with those girls and see them grow. But they’re under a microscope, you know, and it’s easy for anyone to sit at home and criticize. You can’t look back at Moolah and all those other people and compare them. Wrestling has changed, it’s different and it’s just moved on.”

Speaking on the criticism thrown at former models, he says: “Those girls are so beautiful, and most of them are models, but every single one of them that I’ve worked with has got a passion to be in the ring. If they didn’t – they wouldn’t be there. I know nothing about football, absolutely nothing. And I can sit and watch and pull it apart, but I can’t go in and do it. Opinions are like backsides, everybody’s got one. I think the girls are very unfortunate that people try to pull them apart. They’re not as good as this, not as good as that. Hey, here’s my opinion: shut your mouth unless you try it.”

“I’ve seen them all get busted open, you know. Trish dislocated her shoulder, or her elbow I think it was. Victoria slapped Beth in the face and broke her jaw, I’ve seen all sorts. And for someone to sit at home and pull the girls apart, especially girls doing this as a profession, as their job, they need to just sit back and enjoy it. As I said before, if you’ve never done it, shut your mouth.”

Check out the full interview here.

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  • jayjayholler

    Well said Mr Finlay!

  • Lanoom

    Predicted his reasoning as soon as I saw the tweet for this story. And this line of reasoning continues to be flawed. I don’t need to go to culinary school, train internationally in multiple styles, work in prep for years, work the line for years, and become a full-fledged chef to think that the food I am being served tastes like crap.

    And I continue to wonder how WWE itself continues to escape major criticism for this division’s mismanagement, which is the REAL problem.

    • Mr. Asstastic

      Given your metaphor, what Finlay’s saying is cook something for yourself or starve to death. :)

      • Lanoom

        That would work if other restaurants/the ability to cook for myself/other women’s divisions didn’t exist, cause then I would be left with no choice. But I do have a choice. And none of the choices I take, including either accepting what is on my plate or starving to death, would change the fact that the food still tastes like crap.

        That’s the problem with this reasoning: it does nothing to excuse the results that we get (or, lately, DON’T get) presented to us. If I work and work and study hard for a math test only to get a D+, that is not excused by the work I put in, ESPECIALLY if the poor results keep happening. Something fundamentally needs to change for me to “get it” and start doing better.

        And the fundamentals here is WWE management and approach to its women’s division, which should be all the focus instead of people perpetuating and responding to the perpetuation of this “Models vs Real Wrestlers” debate.

    • norisclouds

      Agreed…and most of the women’s he’s talking about that he trained are not the same ones wrestling in WWE now.

      • Raekon

        @Lanoom
        As you can read, what he wrote was about the critisism many people are giving to the divas blaming them for the state of the division.
        He didn’t excused the management at all.

        So what you are saying actually has barely anything with what he said cause he is talking about fans bashing the divas for being “useless” while you are bashing the wwe for making them look “useless” even they are not.

        @Norisclouds
        He trained most of the ones that are still in the division aswell.

        • Lanoom

          His reasoning practically amounts to “Unless you get in there and do it, you don’t know anything,” which is completely flawed logic that only exists to deflect blame. Whether the consumer/viewers can get in and perform the entertainment or the service is irrelevant. The quality of the people that are wholly responsible for what is presented to us at shows, that being the performers and the company managing them, is unaffected by anyone else’s inability or unwillingness to do the same.

          “But they try hard” is nothing but hot air that doesn’t even accomplish its goal of DEFENDING them. If you want to defend the performers, say “They’re given little time to work with and are proven to put on good shows when given the time and support.” Because, once again, the problem goes tot he root in WWE’s management decisions.

          He chose to focus on fans as somehow not getting it, instead of getting to the root of the problem in management. He is perpetuating a pointless debate centered on criticism that also misses its mark. The Diva-Dirt article/discussion on the “Models vs Wrestlers” debate, at least, also pointed to WWE management

          You can point to “He’s just answering the question he was asked,” but it’s still a failure to point out the problem.

        • norisclouds

          Regardless of whether he trained them or not most of them are fucking terrible.

          Now, it’s not their fault they are booked like trash and treated like objects, but just because you aren’t a wrestler doesn’t mean you can’t criticize a botch or a crappy match when you see one…especially if you are paying to sit through it.

        • drewrey

          @ Lanoom- I really think you need to relax, I do not understand why you are getting so mad at the fact that Finlay is defending the divas from fans who tear them apart. Does it happen………yes, it happens too much, so he as the right to defend the divas. I do not think he had any intention of “deflecting” any blame on the fans, I think you took what he said a little to personal, if you don’t rip the divas apart with your criticism, then you should not be so defensive, like you said it is management, not the girls.

        • Lanoom

          @Dewrey – Far from angry, but I am passionate about this division and seeing it improve. I disapprove of Finlay’s answer because he’s most certainly a voice deserving respect in both the wrestling industry and on this particular topic, but his reasoning is one that has been often blindly repeated and continues to be as weak as ever.

        • Lanoom

          Apologies for misspelling your name initially, Drewrey. :)

        • Raekon

          @Lanoom
          It might be flawed but at the end of the day it is true.
          We take the bumps and athletisism of wrestling for granted and do as if it is something we would do ourselves as if it were a piece of cake to execute certain moves or take certain bumps.

          Most people saying only “meh… everything is fake” only because the routine is scripted to prevent bad injuries and so they have more control over the outcome for storyline purposes, forgetting that the physicallity remains true and its not fake at all.

          So most fans don’t like the divas because the management doesn’t let the shine and show what they really can do but instead of critisizing the management like you did (because you are a person that “gets it” and understand where the real problem is), they are ripping the divas apart left and right calling them all kind of names including swearing and asking for their releases.

          That’s were his logic also applies and most of the fans is flawed.
          Why? Because many of the fans that are angry towards models are praising, Trish, Victoria, Mickie that were modeling before aswell (Mickie was even a stripper in her hometown).

          What matters to me is not their background but rather what these people can bring on the table and how hard they are working to accomplish that.

          According to Finlay, Golddust and other that have trained divas in ovw, wwe and fcw, the hard workers mostly stick around unless they get fed up and can’t take it anymore like ivory, jillian, Gail, Melina or Michelle, or a injury applys like with candice michelle, Ashley and others.

          Of course sometimes also because they don’t know what to do with one anymore (like the stupid uncreatives did with Jazz, Luna, Jaqueline) or because they think one has grown too old on age(as of the last few years in which they want to have only young divas there).

          So judging upon a match we watch while talking about spots its of course ok but bashing them 24/7 without knowing how it is to be in their boots? :/

          @TheJoshiFanX
          In fact everytime they have longer matches you can see that they can work a match.

          However, when you get 30 seconds in which you need to rush, bad things can happen and that doesnt only apply to a diva but also to the superstars.

      • thejoshifanx

        if a woman can’t work a match, or doesn’t get to the level to where she can, then she is useless as far as wrestling goes, which is what matters most

        • drewrey

          I understand being passionate, I am also passionate about the divas, and womens wrestling as a whole!! I feel like Fit was with the girls for so long, he is just being protective of them, yeah his reasoning may have been repeated over and over by others, but it is true. No matter how tired or weak it maybe, it is true, and he would know first hand, he trained so many other women, he knows how hard they work, if it had come form anyone else, I might have agreed with you. I don’t believe he was excusing what the WWE has done with the women, he was being defensive of the women he used to work with, that’s all. Oh and no problem, you know about misspelling my name.

        • drewrey

          and I just reread ur comment, and realized what u were really saying.LOL.Well, maybe he should have used another analogy, but I think he was addressing the fans who say the women do not work hard!!!!!!

        • thejoshifanx

          Well they don’t. If they did, then they wouldn’t be horrible in the ring. :P

        • drewrey

          I hope ur being sarcastic, also, my comment was supposed to be for lanoom!!!!!!:p

        • thejoshifanx

          No I’m not being sarcastic but whatever haha

        • drewrey

          yeah, I quess the right word is whatever!!:p

  • Mr. Asstastic

    mte

  • WWFoverWWE

    He’s talking about the womens division overall in the last decade, not specifically the current one.

  • Joshi Rules

    “As I said before, if you’ve never done it, shut your mouth.”

    So if you have never been a professional wrestler you are not entitled to have any opinion whatsoever? :rollseyes:

    The people who are complaining are the consumers of the product. They have every right to complain if the product is substandard. I would not mind models as wrestlers as much if there were no other readily available alternative and they were capable of having great matches. But there are scores of great indie wresters who have far more ability, far more passion for the business, and are far more capable of putting on a great match then the models. Those great indie wrestlers are ignored by the majors so the likes of the WWE can strut eye candy on Raw/Smackdown each week for one to two minute farce matches.

    The Diva’s division and the WWE fans deserve better than what the WWE is currently giving us.

    • thejoshifanx

      Dude amen

      If WWE wants to hire good looking women who can wrestle in addition to ones who can just wrestle, I’d be all for that! There are tons of hot women who can wrestle, and WWE could please both types of fans by having them in a legitimate divison.

  • MJWDO

    That’s why I love Mr. Finlay

  • LadyGoDiva

    What Finlay is saying about the Divas of the last decade but the Divas of this current decade I think he has the same opinion like everyone else about how the WWE mistreats their women’s division.

    Its a real shame how far the divas division has come because everyone says that they still have potential to be great and its great to see Eve this week and its great to see AJ be in a storyline, its more great seeing Maxine on NXT even though she should be on Smackdown and I love seeing Rosa Mendes be in the position that she deserves.

    Hopefully in 2012 the WWE will shed light on their problems like the tag team and women’s divsion to the standards they were ten years ago.

  • psykohurricane

    I completly agree with finlay on this. Sure it’s o.k to have an opinion about the divas but in no way shape or form have any of us have to right to criticize them on their workrate. Sure some of them aren’T has good as some of the indy wrestlers but some thing is certainly sure these girls are way better then any of us who are complaining about how bad they are in the ring.

    So for those of you that doesn’T like the fact that somebody that’s actually have been in the business for a long time tell you that you don’T have the right to criticize the workrate of the divas, Tough luck, because i completly agree with him, unless you’Ve been been in the business or train to become a wrestlers, you don’T have the right to criticize the workrate of the divas.

  • http://www.twitter.com/jillianhalltna JillianHallTNA

    Why the hell does he mentioned Trish, Tara and Beth. We call them real wrestlers and respect them (most of us). What did Bellas do, what did Kelly Kelly do, what did Rosa do? Nothing!!!!!!!
    They should be fired and sign real wrestlers who worked so hard and never will get paid for what they do. And those models just come here and stole money for 30 seconds of the match? No thanks. WWE should sign Sara Del Rey and every other indy star and send those models to indy shows, if they stay alive and do well THEN they can sign with WWE. But no, models are too fancy to go wrestle on indys…

    • Lanoom

      While I also had a nice guffaw at how he only mentions women we tend to already respect, hiring the good indie girls (let us not fool ourselves into thinking that just because it’s indie, it’s good) would change nothing without changing the fundamentals of WWE’s mismanagement and lack of support for the division, which your proposed solution is only a part of.

    • Raekon

      He mentioned trish and tara because they were also models prior to wwe.
      They were fitness models like Kaitlyn.

    • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

      “They should be fired and sign real wrestlers who worked so hard and never will get paid for what they do”

      Oh really? does Sara Del Rey work 300 days a year? does Sara Del Rey constantly travel all round the world? Yes she may be a far better wrestler but her schedule is very easy compared to Divas.. Sara has lots of time to train.

      Excuse the Divas for not having enough time to brush up since they are too busy trying to get to the next destination to please ungrateful fans…

      • thejoshifanx

        Well maybe they should have went through actual wrestling training before going on TV! :O There’s a good idea.

        • norisclouds

          Yea even Trish and Lita said this…that they needed an aggressive screening campaign, a boot camp, and all of the other things fans were pushing for…no one bitched and moaned about them giving their opinions.

          Did Finlay ever ask Trish or Lita what they thought because they were tremendously critical of the current divas.

          No, I guess people who pay to watch WWE are just not entitled to have the same opinions as two former wrestlers…

  • Melina&Mickie4ever!

    Notice how he said “Here’s My Opinion” , Well just like him many fans of female wrestling has “Their Opinions”

    • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

      What matters more?

      The opinion of a “fan” who sits at home every night criticising a product yet watches it every week, someone who has never tried the product.

      or a wrestler, who has seen the girls hard work pay off, someone who can relate to them, as he has taken bumps and so have they.

      • http://wrestlinggirl1993.tumblr.com/ xoxoRKOxoxo

        I 1000% agree with you!!!!!!

      • Melina&Mickie4ever!

        @Future endeveaendeveoured -None to be honest! Finlay can have his opinion on anyone just like everybody else has. Can he call someone a bad actor when him himself has probably never acted? Yea he can because once again its his opinion of how he feels

      • thejoshifanx

        Lol most of the divas don’t even take bumps. They’re too dainty. Even when they do, they don’t know how to take them properly. :P

        • Raekon

          you must be watching too many cartoons or something else I guess cause what you are typing here is definately not true.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well you must not be watching the divas then because the “diva’ type women can’t wrestle

        • Raekon

          @TheJoshiFanx
          I’m watching the divas prior to the “divas” naming of them when they were still called women which is obviously something you didn’t.

          My favourite survivor series in which the women were involved was back in 1987. Enough said or wanna argue a bit more about how blinded you are and how much unjustice you are doing these girls only because of what you are getting served on the current raw and sd?

          Finlays sayings might by flawed a bit but he trained the divas and he knows much better if they can wrestle or not than we all do.

      • Kessuki

        quite frankly the fans matter more because they are the ones paying for the wages for these models/wrestlers. im not too annoyed about the quality anymore as i can find something else to watch as my interest in wrestling has cooled quite a lot. however its the same case with football or a concert – you pay to watch and if its sub-par you have the right to be critical and judgmental about what you paid for. Finlay is defending his own training he did on these women and the fact is his training has worked once but hasnt worked on this crop of models. whose to blame? wwe.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well I don’t have a lot of money to spend on wrestling and I believe that WWE has a standard to live up to, so of course I’m going to speak out.

        • Raekon

          @Kessuki
          The only ones he didn’t train were Naomi, Aksana, Kaitlyn and the divas that came after them.

          He was also responsible for quite a few other things too and got released because of a stupid action back in 2010.

          To put the miz more over at that time that he was the top heel, he let his entrance interrupt the national anthem and the military general that was present felt “insulted” so even finlay apologized, mc mahon released him to even things out and make the general “happy”again.

  • http://twitter.com/lostmikeys Kaledrina

    lol, I really can’t stand the whole “if you’ve never done it, you aren’t allowed to judge” mentality, grow up. we’re supposed to just sit here and watch and be happy with the crap we see? yes, everyóne has an opinion and some times they’re pretty negative, but we are allowed to feel how we feel. the fact they get so much stick should show people actually care? People want the division to succeed? Reach it’s full potential? Aiyiyi.

    I’ve never sang infront of a live audience so by default every single person who auditions for the xfactor is awesomely talented??? lol

  • chrisP

    “That’s the problem with this reasoning: it does nothing to excuse the results that we get (or, lately, DON’T get) presented to us. If I work and work and study hard for a math test only to get a D+, that is not excused by the work I put in, ESPECIALLY if the poor results keep happening. Something fundamentally needs to change for me to “get it” and start doing better.”

    Damn right. Hard work and good work are two completely different things.

  • thejoshifanx

    Well I plan on becoming a wrestler soon (I need the money to move and for training) and believe me, I will still be criticizing those women. Sure, I respect the fact that they go out there, but I don’t respect the fact that they can’t work a decent match. If this is how wrestling has changed than that is damn pathetic. Haha.

    • http://twitter.com/lostmikeys Kaledrina

      totally, it’s actually bizarre how he’s saying not to judge the ladies as I translate it as him saying they’re great and shouldn’t be criticised? hello? even if the likes of the bellas and kelly were phenomenal in the ring, criticism comes with the job (don’t be on tv if you don’t want people watching you!!), and there’s always room for improvement whether you’re a alicia fox or a beth phoenix.

      • thejoshifanx

        Exactly. I totally need to have an anti diva/indy & puroresu elitist gimmick going when I wrestle. :P

      • Raekon

        @Kaledrina
        what he is saying there is not to critisize their background cause no matter where they are coming from prior to wwe, they still work hard to improve and be as good as they can.

        It was merely a response because of the people that can’t let it be calling out the divas that were modeling prior to wrestling and to be honest its also very annoying cause it has NOTHING to do with their current job, nor has it to do with their talent.

        It’s a fact that the best among them had a sports/athletic background while the others had none.

        That shows that having a sports background is beneficial when it comes to wrestling. Even a dancer background (Layla, Alicia, Naomi) helps a lot.

  • StraightEdgeCRF

    here’s my opinion.if the WWE would let the divas have more time in the ring to show what they got,there would be less criticism from the fans.how can the fans take the divas seriously when we barely see them in the ring?

    • thejoshifanx

      Because they obviously can’t work a match. Two minutes of hair pulling, screeching, and doing a few sloppy random moves is enough of an indicator that they’re horrible. They’re also not wrestlers and I don’t think one of the “divas” would continue to wrestle after being future endeavored. They’re just there for looks.

      • Raekon

        Once again untrue.
        All of them can work decent to great matches and they have proved it either down in fcw in which they have a bit more freedom on their movesets and in previous eras in which they didn’t got as limited as they are for a few years now(mostly 2009 and later).

        What you see about the hair pulling, screeching and stuff is what Vince mc Mahon and John Laurenaitis want them to do and to be cause they are not allowed to outshine even the worstest male wrestlers on the roster.

        Shoot kicks are forbidden for Divas to even give an example.
        Go tell that to shimmer that are using them left and right because they are allowed to use their full movesets and everything else.

        It’s easy to blame it on the divas because you see what you see, if you put a little effort to see how they really are in houseshows (partially), in fcw and a few years before(2008 and earlier), you will see the difference.

        Even Kelly had worked great matches with her limited moveset back then, while now she exchanged real wrestling moves for the buttslap and stinkface Vince and John love so much. -.-

        • thejoshifanx

          Lol divas and great matches. Hell even decent matches. Um, okay. The ones with wrestling backgrounds and Naomi are the only decent ones.

          If you watch wrestling outside of WWE and TNA you’ll see that the other woman are horrible. If you put them in the indys or Japan they couldn’t survive.

  • A.E

    while i repect his opinion but girls like trish and tara/victoria someone he worked with they raised the bar soo high they made us proud of what they achieved but seeing the new girls like kelly and the bella they lowed the level of the women wrestling girls like them and i don’t wanna sound mean they are giving the women wrestling a bad name.

  • moogle

    “Those girls are so beautiful, and most of them are models, but every single one of them that I’ve worked with has got a passion to be in the ring. If they didn’t – they wouldn’t be there. I know nothing about football, absolutely nothing. And I can sit and watch and pull it apart, but I can’t go in and do it. ”

    EXACTLY.

    • thejoshifanx

      Well I have the passion to play video games but does that mean I’m any good at it? Not very much. It’s like calling some noob who plays Battlefield an FPS expert because they play the game. There’s a fine line between the noobs and avid or professional gamers.

    • http://twitter.com/lostmikeys Kaledrina

      the thing is, I don’t recall ever seeing anyone saying something along the lines of ‘I can do better than her!’ It’s more ‘they/she can do better if they trained harder!’. Like, if I thought somebody couldn’t drive very well, it doesn’t mean I want to be the one driving?? Rebecca black not being able to sing doesn’t mean I want to become the next youtube sensation!

      Criticism sucks, especially very negative criticism, but for the most part it is constructive criticism because we love them models and want to see them do better!

      Finlay suggesting the model divas should be immune from people judging their ringwork because they’re beautiful is silly, they’re grown up women not little weak girls who are gonna break down in tears, they can deal with it. And if they can’t deal with being told they can’t do a rollup correct or sell a move worth a damn, then they’re obviously not suited for being in the spotlight.

      • thejoshifanx

        To be honest, they’re not even beautiful to some people. I think Jessicka Havok and Sara del Rey are much better looking than any of the divas and the only “diva” I find attractive is Sofia Cortez.

        I understand what you say though, you are one of the few sensible people on here. I would like if WWE would send the divas to train in a Japanese wrestling dojo. HILARIOUS.

        • http://twitter.com/lostmikeys Kaledrina

          sensible? lol thanks, I try my hardest :). It’s so easy to just whine and name call, etc when it comes to the divas, sensible debate is what I like! although are you allowed to call me sensible? isn’t that an opinion? you don’t live my life so how dare you have an opinion on me :P

        • thejoshifanx

          OMG I HAZ AN OPINION! I must be burned at the hypothetical stake!

  • KidKamikaze

    Crappy response that ignores the idea of criticism by applying an unreasonable standard.

    I get that he’s trying to defend them, but this defensive response does the ladies no favors.

    As someone else said, I can respect them for putting in the hard work, but if I don’t believe they are performing on an adequate level, then I have the right to voice that complaint, and back it up if need be.

    • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

      trolling on the women doesn’t do them favours either, because some random person calls Kelly crap does that instantly make her run back for more training?

  • Mikas

    When a diva repeatedly fails to properly run the ropes (something you learn on your first day in training), you dont need to be a trained professional to know that that person either doesnt care or simply cant do better.

    There is 1 thing i agree with him though. Models can become good wrestlers, just look at Yumi Ohka, Fuuka, Shu Shibutani, Misaki Ohata, Cherry, Apply Miyuki. There were all “athtresses” or “idol wrestlers”, basicly the japanese version of divas, but they all ended up becoming solid wrestlers, some of them are even among the best in Japan right now. So it is possible to transform a model into a wrestler, but that doesnt mean everyone can. For every idol wrestler in japan that became succesful there were 4 that sucked, the entire JD’STAR promotion was filled with them, only 3 of them became really good (ohka, shibutani, ohata), but i think those 3 all have a Judo background, so naturally that helped them.

    • Joel

      Yay, you mentioned Misaki. ^.^

      From what I’ve heard, Misaki had no sport background whatsoever. She has been wrestling a couple of months longer than K2 (I think) and look how much better she is.

    • thejoshifanx

      Yeah, Japan definitely can turn an athress or gravure idol into a wrestler. I wish they would send the divas over there to train and then see how well they do. The thing is with those Japanese women, while some don’t care, the ones you mentioned and other ones put forth effort into becoming better while divas don’t. The only gripe I have with all of these women in Japan that become wrestlers though is that in modern times, it’s almost all you get is the same type of woman and there is no variety like there used to be.

    • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

      Wrestlers are taught to run the ropes with their bad feet, some wrestlers can run with both feet, some can’t, which explains bad rope running. You don’t even learn it in much detail, they tell you to run them for a while then that’s it, they have more important things to teach.

      and have YOU ever ran the ropes? I’m guessing you haven’t. Them ropes are hard as fuck, I’ve seen people get severe rope burn and develop bad back problems. It’s not exactly a walk in the park you know. Finlay said that if you haven’t tried it, then how can you tell how it’s done right?

      How does she not care about the product? Why is she there if she does not have a care? and don’t say “for the money”… being a WWE wrestler is possibly the worst way possible of earning ‘easy money’ I mean you go through rigorous training, put your body on the line, perform 300 days out of the year, travel constantly where you are away from friends, parents etc. You have to put up with stuck up fans such as yourself and also with locker room politics. I’m pretty sure it would be easier to stay modelling.

      • thejoshifanx

        They don’t put on good matches therefore they dont’ care. Plain and simple haha.

        • thejoshifanx

          don’t*

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          so it’s the Divas’ faults that their matches are short and bad? Yeah because everyone gets to control length and what moves are used/

        • thejoshifanx

          Even in two minute matches, the women with no previous wrestling background are horrible. It’s a fact. You can take the SHIMMER women and put them in two minutes matches and it would be a billion times better than the divas.

        • Raekon

          @TheJoshiFanX
          what you ignore when you typing such things allover the place is the following:

          - shimmer wrestlers have the freedom to use their movesets
          - wwe divas are NOT allowed to use their movesets

          Victoria already mentioned that, Michelle mentioned the limitations, Gail Kim did and thats only 3 of them.

          When you get told you are not allowed to do this and that but you have to do a match with only slapping, hairpulling and a rollup, then you have no choice.

          So you suck it up, go out there, do what you are supposed to do and leave again.

      • JamieKym

        @Futureendeavored yes it is their fault a little. Yes WWE makes these matches so short but the Divas are not taking a stand at all. They’re just letting it happen. You learn to run the ropes the first day. I’m currently training.
        .

        • norisclouds

          Yea and I’m gonna be honest here, I’ve never been a big Candice fan–EVER. But I’ve seen Candice execute her moves with less botches and with better flow in 3 minute matches that Alicia and company frequently mess up.

          I mean come on! Candice wasn’t perfect by any means, but was a good example of a hard worker model-turned wrestler who could have been great if not for her injuries. I really respect the hard work she put in and the injuries she came back from to go in the ring, even if she never reached her potential because of those injuries.

        • Steve_x

          Jamiekym, the divas can’t suggest getting better treatment. Torrie & Melina have asked for more time and suggested ideas, but WWE refused. WWE doesn’t care what the divas what. I hate how people blame the divas, but not WWE.

    • Winterlina

      Totally agree with Mikas.

  • http://www.diva-dirt.com candice7000

    I totally agree with Finlay. I wish WWE would let him and Goldust and Trish run the division. Give them all the power. But I really understand what these girls go through. I myself use to wrestle. And let me tell you it is not easy. I came in with no type of training or anything. Never played a sport or condition my body. All I know is I wanted to be the next Trish Stratus (or more so Candice Michelle because she is my all time favorite diva.) of the independent scene of Chicago. I had to go through alot of training. It wasn’t easy. My trainers was very hard on me. The head trainer really believed in me. The others was mean( one got fired because a wrestler got injured and he didn’t do shit about it and he would actually take a stick and beat the male wrestlers with it.) -Note at first it was another female wrestler besides me, but she quit so I was the only one. Basically I ended up quitting, just because my peers was giving me a hard time about being a female wrestler and coming from no where(Btw I’m like the same size as A.J. so they also gave me hell for that). I love wrestling and always wanted to be a Diva. But it was so much and being in that sport with politics and haters in the same locker room as you is hard. The training you could adapt to if your heart was in it like mine. I do plan to return to wrestling some day, because I truly miss it. Music is my other love which is what I’m focused on now. So this is why I respect girls like Eve, Kelly, The Bellas, Maryse, Alicia , Layla Hell!! Even Rosa. It is not easy and these girls truly have a passion for it, if they stayed this long and endured all the negativity that comes with it. You have no other choice but to respect them if you know how it is.

  • http://www.facebook.com/StaceyJohnWood SAEGAN

    I like Finlay, but I respectfully disagree. When it comes to the WWE Divas, we know who the truly passionate one’s are.(The hardcore fans atleast)

    • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

      what exactly constitutes you a “hardcore fan”?

      • thejoshifanx

        I’m guessing someone who actually cares about the wrestling part of it

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          wouldn’t every fan be a hardcore fan then?

        • thejoshifanx

          The WRESTLING part of it. If you think the divas are good in the ring, then you don’t care, which is the way some people here think.

    • psykohurricane

      By Hardcore fans do you means the fans that criticize everything about wrestling even if they don’T know anything or actually try to do it or fans that have been following wrestling for a long time and respect everybody that have been in that ring no matter how bad a wrestler they were at long as they were entertaining? So if your answer is the second one then, i’m consider a hardcore fan, if not then i just don’T want to be known as one?

      • thejoshifanx

        How about you don’t put me into a label without knowing anything about me? It’s obvious you were directing that snide comment towards me.

        I’m a huge wrestling fan and have been following it for quite some time.

        I don’t sit there and criticize everything about wrestling, this is one subject. I take an issue with divas and the divas division because it’s sad. I also never said I didn’t respect them. I respect the fact that they go out there and perform. What I don’t respect is the fact that they can’t wrestle. I’m not a typical WWE fan who takes everything that they give them and is happy about it. I’m a vocal woman and am going to voice my opinion on what I feel like is pathetic.

      • psykohurricane

        @thejoshifanX, First of all, my comment wasn’T directed at you at all, it was directed at @seagan for talking about the HArdcore wrestling fan, so Sorry if you took it personnal it wasn’t my intention. Secondly, i’m happy to know that you want to go and learn how to wrestle, if that’S your passion then i say go for it but i have to warn you that if you dream is to got to a big organization like WWE or TNA, you will have to realise that the photoshoot and the image the woman project on screen is more important then wrestling talent. I for one i’m a huge woman wrestling fans and if i want to see woman’S wrestles, i will go to a indy’s show or buy a shimmer dvd but i sure as hell won’t watch TNA or WWE for woman matches because that not what the major companies are all about. The point i was making is simple, alot of those divas are getting a rough deal by wrestling fans because of how they look, but most of them don’t deserve to be treated like that and i don’t think it far to judge a wrestlers (male or female) workrate if your don’T know anything about what it’S takes to be a wrestlers.

        • thejoshifanx

          My dream isn’t WWE or TNA, I don’t want to go to either company.I have no interest in either of them. I want to move to and wrestle in Japan full time, and wrestle in the US, Canada, England, Mexico, all over the world. I’d like to be a huge name in Japan. I’d also like to break down more gender barriers, wrestle for Dragon Gate, and wrestle in the New Japan Junior Heavyweight division maybe competing in the Best of the Super Juniors or compete for the IWGP Junior Heavyweight Championship. Become an indy god.

          The reason I “judge” the women is because they’re horrible in the ring. If they could wrestle, then I wouldn’t have as much of an issue with them.

  • FashionQueen86

    Here is my opinion of it. If I as consumer/fan is going to buy, watch and/or experience a product, I better enjoy it. I can understand a few oops’ and mistakes, but something that continues and continues every week!? Seriously, do I not have a right to be a just a tad be pissed here?

    It sucks to be repeatedly let down and disappointed when those girls get in the ring and show me poor bookings of a match. I am glad that a male figure such as Finley is supporting them becuase I’m assuming that the WWE company is run by many males who simply don’t give a crap about them. Many people are sick and tired of people complaining, but I’m sick tired of being sick and tired of divas receiving UNFAIR treatment! If guys can get in that ring with a decent amount of time and beat each other up, why is it so MUCH to ask for the divas? Can ANYBODY give me an answer to that? Didn’t Mickie James and Madison have a 9-minute cell match a while ago? girls as little as Madison can get in that ring and perform well!

    • thejoshifanx

      I don’t give a damn about divas. I care about women’s wrestlers. I don’t want to see these models, etc. who can’t work a match. I want to see good performances. Wrestlers.

      It’s true that WWE doesn’t care about the women because they’re sexist. The women are objectified, have to do photoshoots, not given time and storylines, and the majority are horrible in the ring. The only reasons the women are still there are 1. for eye candy (which I don’t get because I don’t find them to be good looking) 2. because they would get negative backlash for not having them on TV.

      For damn sake WWE calls their women DIVAS. That goes to show you how much they don’t care.

      We need to stop caring.

      • psykohurricane

        I’m going to ask you a question then. Do you think you can do better then them? Sure the WWE don’T care about the divas but unless you’ve are a wrestler yourself, you cannot talk about their workrate because you don’T know what it takes to be a wrestlers. I know for sure that if you talk to any of the woman’S wrestlers in the indy’s, they wouldn’t criticize the diva’s for the workrate.

        The best exemple and i can give if you we’re doing your job and i decided to pay you a visit and after that i go on the internet and say how i saw you work today and thought that you just weren’T good at your job.

        So you can criticize how WWE doesn’T give the diva’s time to wrestle or how bad the match was, that’S o.k. but to criticize how bad there workrate was, that another things completly different and unless you can walk a mile in thier shoes, you have no right to criticize the diva’S workrate.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well your argument is flawed because you can critique something you are a fan of. Much like people who rate movies but aren’t actors or actresses.

          Well I am saving up my spare money to become a wrestler, and I plan on training here in the US at a respected center, and then traveling the world honing my craft, and I want to move to Japan and spend my career there. I want to be the best in the world someday, so when I do, I’m still going to be anti diva and criticize mainstream wrestling, I know what it takes to be a wrestler, and I plan on doing it, and working hard to be very good in ring.

  • missawesomeness

    finlays missing the point, people are paying good money to watch raw, sd ect frankly they waste there money because certain divas can’t do there job, wwe is fully aware of this and yet they do nothing.

  • http://wrestlinggirl1993.tumblr.com/ xoxoRKOxoxo

    i want everyone who critized about wat Finlay said to go and get in to a wwe ring and wrestle are the wwe divas the best wrestlers in the world no but they FIGHT HARD and try there very best to improve people critize everything they do!!!!

    as an example if kelly kelly didn’t want to be in the wwe do you think she would she is a former model and she probably could have a very successful modeling career but no shes in that ring almost ever wee fighting to prove she deserves to be there!!

    don’t say she doesn’t want to be a wwe diva because obivously she does or don’t say Eve doesn’t want to be a wwe diva because she does.

    do they look like Beth or Natalya no!! did they dream about doing it since they were kids no but that doesn’t mean a god damn thing!!! yes Beth and Natalya are the better wrestlers but they have never defended the World Heavyweight Championsip do you know who did Kelly Kelly!!! and i remember watching that match and it is one of my favorite WWE Diva matchs of all time because it was history being made!!! she did something no other diva has ever done!!! and i agree with finaly until you have done something where in the hell do you get off judging somebody who tries their hardest every week!!!!

    if you want to blame anybody for crappy matches blame wwe manegment for give the divas 30 seconds of the show and not giving a damn about them!!!

    • thejoshifanx

      “wwe divas the best wrestlers in the world”

      Wow. That statement is sad. They are from it, and in fact some of the worst. If you want good female wrestling, watch ACW, CHIKARA, SHIMMER, Pro Wrestling EVE, Women Superstars Uncensored. THAT is wrestling.

      It doesn’t matter how long the matches are either, if they can’t wrestle, it’s still going to be horrible.

      • http://wrestlinggirl1993.tumblr.com/ xoxoRKOxoxo

        i didnt say that the divas are best wrestlers in the world i know there not but people give them shit for stuff they can’t control you try to train while your traviling for 300 plus days a year. you wrestle in a company that could give two craps about there divas i know that ACW, CHIKARA, SHIMMER, Pro Wrestling EVE, Women Superstars Uncensored all of them have beyond amazing talent but don’t blame the divas because a company hires based on looks give them credit were credit is do they try the very best. do they botch yes and are their matches crappy yes how about you ask wwe to acctually prepare their divas with acctual wrestling ability befor they put them in the ring!! all those promotions you named acctually give a crap about their talent where WWE doesn’t. i wish WWE would be like the other companies that give women the oppurtunity to shine in a male dominated sport! WWE doesn’t relize that there are a lot of people out there that acctually care about womens wrestling. to WWE women are just eye candy to attract horny boys to watch raw and smackdown. but they try there very best and don’t need people like you and half the other people who critize them telling them the suck tell that to WWE bitch and moan all you want don’t watch the wwe womens matches stick to SHIMMER and Pro Wrestling EVE but relize that kelly was signed in May 2006 and debuted on tv in june 2006 that is in now way in hell enough time to learn even semi good wreslting skills. and if WWE by some miracle did give a crap about their divas and gave them the chance to train than you wouldn’t be so made that there 2 minute matches were horrible!

        • http://wrestlinggirl1993.tumblr.com/ xoxoRKOxoxo

          thejoshifanx i want to see you first match because i am going to do what you seemingly do i will critized every miss step you make!!!!

        • thejoshifanx

          Exactly. WWE needs

          1. To stop hiring women just based on looks. Have talent be the first priority.
          2. To stop calling the women divas and call them wrestlers
          3. To give them TV time and storylines
          4. To respect them
          5. To let them wrestle, and don’t tell them not to outshine the men

          If WWE invested effort, they could make it as big as the US/Intercontinental scene.

          (Side note WWE- If you want to get me to like the looks of your women, hire someone like Jessicka Havok! This lesbian thinks she’s a billion times better looking than the divas. Of course, besides liking women who can wrestle, I like HOT women who can wrestle too, I have to admit that)

        • http://wrestlinggirl1993.tumblr.com/ xoxoRKOxoxo

          i agree with everything you listed i mean when i think of the word diva i think a snobby stuck bitch not a womens wrestler for the longest time the only reason i watch raw was because of Lita and Trish. i just wish WWE would give a damn about the womens division and scoop up all the divas from SHIMMER and other promotions and let creative make up storylines and angles and they’d be able to make a lot of money because there strong women who can wrestle and are beautiful women thats all we want!!!!

        • thejoshifanx

          Of course my first match isn’t going to be great but the difference between me and them is I would actually put forth effort into improving.

          Uh dude there are no divas in SHIMMER. They have wrestlers.

          Yeah, the word diva means what it means and that’s how WWE portray their women. The ones that can wrestle need to be called WRESTLERS.

          WWE could make it profitable but let’s not joke around they are not going to.

        • http://wrestlinggirl1993.tumblr.com/ xoxoRKOxoxo

          i know i accidently wrote divas sorry i meant wrestlers!!! and about your first match i legit wanna see it!!!!!! and the day the wemon wrestlers become important to WWE is the day i become president of the united states n btw im a chick not a dude i havent figured out ow to put a picture up yet im kinda technology idiotic!!!!

        • thejoshifanx

          Women are still dudes

  • Winterlina

    So… is he saying that if you’ve had the training and you’ve been in the ring, you can criticize how bad the models are? Because I think that leaves my opinion in tact.

    Also to continue from what he said, if a fans opinion of the divas or model divas, doesn’t matter, than surely his opinion of people’s opinions of the model divas doesn’t matter. So that makes this whole thing redundant. Right?

    It would be easier if everyone would stop trying to defend them. It’s not going to change anyone’s mind and it’s only going to piss people off more.

    • Winterlina

      Divas fans are already a horribly divided group of fans and when situations like this occur it makes things worse. I understand everyone has different view points but when you pretty much bash people for having an opinion, after you’ve just given an opinion as well makes you look petty.

      That’s why sometimes even here, I feel like the writers judge women’s wrestling fans and that’s only because they make it seem like if you’re not a fan of K2 or Rosa or the Bellas than you’re a horrible person for judging them. As if we’re not allowed to critique their work, like we should just sit there with this smile on our faces and nod with approval.

      Pro wrestling is just like any other form of entertainment. Movie, TV, Music, you’re paying with your money or with your presence to be entertained and if you’re not, you’re going to say something. It’s the nature of business and if you honestly can’t handle criticism than you are in the wrong business because it’s going to happen, NO MATTER WHAT.

    • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

      He’s basically saying you can’t call someone bad at doing certain moves, bad at taking bumps, bad at doing etc. You (not you personally) have never done something like that, so how can you (the fans) say someone is doing it wrong?

      • thejoshifanx

        Well I am going to be a wrestler, I just need the money for training and to move, and I’m still going to criticize them for being talentless hacks.

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          I can’t wait to see your first match.. will make me LOL at how you and all the marks think they can wrestle and think they will be better then certain wrestlers

        • thejoshifanx

          I never said that I can wrestle but I actually want to be a WRESTLER not a diva. I plan on training at a respected center here in the US and then going to Japan where I’d like to spend most of my career, besides wrestling here in the US and in England, Mexico, other places. I am going to work as hard as I can to be the best in ring possible. I’m not going to objectify myself, dress like a slut, do slutty photoshoots, wrestle before I’m trained properly, and wrestle in two minute matches with no storylines. The difference between me and those women is I actually care about the business.

        • Jhonmarco

          Have you even met any of these women to say they don’t care about the business? Really ignorant comment. And slutty photoshoots? The Divas’ photoshoots are mostly them in nice, elegant dresses & their ring gear? How is that slutty?

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          because this is the 1920s.. and to these people, if you don’t cover up your entire body you are a slut

        • thejoshifanx

          1. If they cared about the business, they would have trained properly. Not to mention, how many of the divas continue to wrestle after they get fired? None.

          2. Some are slutty, but even the ones that aren’t are objectifying. Do you see the men doing photoshoots besides when they get new gear or a championship? No. They’re there to be ogled.

        • thejoshifanx

          No, I don’t mind the occasional photoshoot like that when it’s rare and done in taste. Like Ayumi Kurihara’s photobook. But when only the women have to do photoshoots is when I have an issue with it.

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          How many Divas continue wrestling after fired? Quite a few actually..

          and anyway, WWE’s schedule is so hectic and stressful that some girls want to go home and, oh I dunno, LIVE THEIR LIFE rather than travelling their entire life. Some people would like to go home, sleep in their own bed, talk to their friends and family again, have some time for themselves. The indy girls can do this, when you’re in WWE, there’s no time for that.

        • Jhonmarco

          Christy Hemme wrestled after her release & due to injuries retired. She worked for TNA, WSU, & other companies trying to step up her game. Maria is working for ROH soon & having a match against Tara on the indies. Those are 2. Objectifying? They’re fully clothed. I see no problem with photoshoots, it’s not like they’re in their bras & panties. Really foolish.

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          nearly half the Divas continue to wrestle after being fired… I mean all but 3 Knockouts are actually Divas

        • thejoshifanx

          The majority don’t. The ones that do, I respect that, as long as they have continual improvement, and don’t stay with just their WWE training.

          It’s objectifying because it’s sexist. The men don’t do a bunch of photoshoots, the women do because they’re just there to look at. When they guys do all those photoshoots too, then I’ll be fine with it.

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          Victoria
          Gail Kim
          Melina
          Jillian
          Maria
          Christy Hemme
          Jackie Gayda
          Jacqueline
          Molly Holly
          Luna
          Dawn Marie
          Lena Yada
          Cherry
          Mickie James
          Katie Lea
          Serena
          Nidia
          Jazz
          Maryse

          not to mention the developmental Divas

        • thejoshifanx

          What are you listing here? I’m talking about DIVAS who still wrestled after WWE. DIVAS are WWE trained models. Ones who had no experience before. What, maybe two were ever good?

          Say a woman like Serena, while I don’t like her, she’s a WRESTLER. Of course she is going to WRESTLE after leaving WWE.

        • http://www.youtube.com/user/ElectricMVx Future Endeavoured

          Diva is a term used by World Wrestling Entertainment (WWE), an American professional wrestling promotion, to refer to its female talent. The term is applied to women who appear as wrestlers, managers or valets, backstage interviewers, or ring announcers.

          hmmm, yeah, why did I mention those girls?

        • thejoshifanx

          Diva = woman with no wrestling experience that was hired by WWE
          Wrestler = someone who wrestled before WWE

          I also consider someone who can actually wrestle without previous experience a wrestler if she is good enough.

          I’m talking about WWE TRAINED WOMEN who wrestle after WWE.

        • Raekon

          You are totally wrong @thejoshifanx.
          @Future endeavoured already wrote the definition.
          Victoria (tara in tna now), mickie, trish were also called divas, katiel lea were called a diva, nattie and beth are called divas.

          Kharma is called a diva.
          That’s the term wwe is using for female wrestlers.

          Also someone who wrestled prior to wwe isn’t automatically better than a diva.

          I have seen many indies that sucked to the bone even after years of training while I have seen divas rocking the ring after a few months of training already (Naomi and Kaitlyn are the best examples).

          Having the passion alone doesn’t make you a good wrestler, you need the athletisism and the talent additionaly to back it up.

          Most of the girls that got listed by @future endeavoured were trained by WWE in their developmental territory (OVW back then).

        • thejoshifanx

          When I say divas I mean women with no wrestling experience before hand. I don’t care what WWE says, wrestlers are wrestlers and divas are divas. Yes, some women on the indys suck, but that happens everywhere. The divas are horrendous though. The only “divas” that have any promise are Maxine and Naomi.

          I never said passion alone makes you a good wrestler, and yes you need athleticism which a lot of the women have, but if you have no talent, you’re useless in the ring. Modern “divas” can’t wrestle besides the occasional exception.

        • Raekon

          @TheJoshiFanX
          That’s exactly the point here which shows that you have no clue.
          Most of all since you are contradicting yourself.
          EVERYONE learns wrestling no matter their previous background.
          No indy wrestler were born as a wrestler, nor one in tna or wwe.

          Natalya wasn’t born in the hart dungeon, she was sent there for training prior to wwe.

          Beth was sent to wwe and trained there her indy days are mainly and mostly based on OVW which was the WWE developmental territory back then.

          Same with Katie Lea among others.

          Do you have experience before hand? You wrote you are currently in training.

          Should we then start question WHY you aren’t made already when you are putting it so as if the others should had been made “before hand”?

          Did you worked with these Divas together yet so you can say if they can really wrestle or not?

          I’m sure they would be able to teach you a lot more than you think.

          Even your mere ignorance towards them wouldn’t let you understand that the main reason they “suck” in the ring is because the management want them to showcase themselves like that.

          They are not supposed to outshine ANY male wrestler on the roster so they are getting reduced on the movesets, time, training among other limitations.

          What you are doing here is supporting exactly these things when you blame it to the divas instead of the management itself.

          - Naomi great in the ring, her dancing background and athletisism helps a lot.

          She lacks the mic skills, partially charisma and segment/acting skills.

          - Maxine tons of charisma, great mic and acting skills.
          Mediocre at its best in the ring after almost 3 years in training.

          So if you would give Naomi Maxines charisma, mic and acting skills you would have the “perfect diva”.

          If you would give Maxine Naomis in ring skills, you would have another “Perfect Diva”.

          Unfortunately NOTHING is perfect in this world and everyone of us has a skill someone else lacks off and vice versa.

          So much on overrating these two by looking away from all the others.

  • bromero329

    i love how he mentioned only three divas. beth victoria and trish. hmmm 3 that are great and can actually wrestle .

    he didnt mention kelly,rosa,bellas

    i think the only ones in wwe right now that can give us great matches are eve layla natalya and beth

    i think the division sucks after seeing this weeks SD spoilers yup it does. and ppl always say oh why does tna keep getting former divas. they get them because htey treat them better and we get to see them shine unlike wwe. so i rather have natalya and beth in tna. Eve i know wouldnt go lol

    but yea finaly you did a great job with the past divas but clearly not a good one with these divas. i hate wwe for not giving us better diva matches but w.e

    • LayTorres

      The thing is, Finlay trained the mentioned divas and then he retired before Kelly, Rosa, or the Bellas legitimately became wrestlers.He didnt get a chance to train them. That’s what I think.

      • Raekon

        @LAYTORRES
        He was the divas trainer prior to Naomi, Aksana, Kaitlyn and every diva that came after Kaitlyn.

        That means he must have trained all the others.

        @Bromero329
        I’m sure that ANY diva from wwe that would go to TNA, would get to shine there by surprising everyone of us and most of all all the people that they they “suck” only because WWE makes them look that way.