Former WWE Star Has Choice Words for Divas Today, Says Majority Are “Terrible”

A match-up between former WWE Divas Champions Melina and Jillian Hall is expected to take place February 4 at the Smart Araneta Coliseum in the Philippines for World Wrestling Fanexperience (WWFX). Former WWE and TNA superstar Shawn Daivari, who will also be at the event, commented on the match while speaking to The Phil Star and had some choice words for the state of WWE’s present women’s division.

He said: “They’re the very best in women’s wrestling today. It’s no secret that WWE women’s wrestling has become awful. With the exception of [Beth] Phoenix and Nattie Neidhart, all the girls are models who attempt to become wrestlers. And they’re all, at this point in their careers, terrible.”

“Melina and Jillian aren’t like that. They’re cut from the same mold as Beth and Nattie. They’re the very best at what they do and they happen to be beautiful. They aren’t beautiful women whom a wrestling promoter recruited to teach them enough to get by three minutes on TV as wrestlers. These girls are both very good. The WWE even hired Jillian to train future Divas because she was that good. I’m glad she declined because now she’s coming to Manila to tear down the house with another world champion in Melina and potentially, put on the best women’s match of the year and we’ve just begun the year.”

Agree? Disagree? Tell us in the comments!

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  • thejoshifanx

    Well the best in women’s wrestling today is Ayako Hamada, Jessicka Havok, Mercedes Martinez, Sara del Rey, etc. Melina is decent though.

    It’s true that they’re terrible. Besides the women with wrestling backgrounds and Naomi (Maxine has potential), they are terrible. They do not belong in a wrestling ring. Models and dancers should be valets, not wrestlers. It’s because of women like them that we now have the “divas” and not “wrestlers”. Sad.

    • Melina&Mickie4ever!

      Melina is decent ?

      Beth Phoenix , Natalya , Melina , Gail Kim , Mickie James , Jillian Hall , Angelina Love , Winter , Madison Rayne , Tara etc etc can be just as tough and indy wrestlers. Sometimes You make it seem as if the Indy wrestlers are WAY above some current Knockouts/Divas & Former current Knockouts/Divas.

      Majority of them all come from the same cream of the crop. More of them just got more opportunities than others. Just because some indy wrestlers has not intrest in wwe nor tna dosent mean they have no respect for Beth , Natalya , Mickie , Melina , Tara , Angelina etc etc. Im sorry but i have been wanting to say something like this to you for a while. I never did because I didnt want to be like majority of people on here Complain -__-

      • thejoshifanx

        I’m talking about the current “divas”. And I said the women with WRESTLING backgrounds were talented so I covered those women. O don’t count wrestlers as “divas” or “knockouts”. Even though I’m not a fan of most of them, I can admit their talent.

        For the current “divas” obviously the women with wrestling backgrounds, but Eve and Layla are pretty decent, Naomi is good, Maxine has a lot of potential, and Kaitlyn could be a star if she properly trained.

        • thejoshifanx

          I*

        • Melina&Mickie4ever!

          I dont think you understand where i was coming from… maybe I read your comment differently than what you were trying to say. When you said

          Well the best in women’s wrestling today is Ayako Hamada, Jessicka Havok, Mercedes Martinez, Sara del Rey, etc. Melina is decent though

          I took it differently ….oh well forget it then

        • thejoshifanx

          Well I meant that Melina is a pretty decent wrestler, but she is not even close to the level of women like that and others at the top of the indys. I was saying that because he said that Melina was the best.

        • Crazy_J

          He didn’t say Melina was the best, he said she is one of the very best. He also was speaking of Jillian when he said that comment, so turning it into Melina is the best isn’t true. I agree with MELINA&MICKIE4EVER because if someone comes out and says Sara Del Rey, or some other female who IS a good wrestler that nobody knows as well, it wouldn’t make much sense to mainstream fans which is who he is targeting by saying that about WWE Diva’s because they are mainstream.

          Just because someone made it to the WWE as a Diva doesn’t mean people weren’t just as behind them when they were in the Indy’s as you are with women that are currently in them. Once they make it to WWE are you going to turn your back on them just because they made it to where they’ll get the most exposure? That makes no sense. You may not be saying that but based on all your comments you think indy women are far better than those on national tv just because they aren’t on national tv? I’m sorry it doesn’t matter how GREAT someone is, they are going to do what the WWE asks them to do if they work for them. We know Beth, Nattie, etc. are more capable of what we see on tv, so don’t think if someone like Sara Del Rey makes it to WWE it’s just gonna change.

        • thejoshifanx

          He said “They are the very best”. While they are somewhat talented, they are not the best. He could have said “They are some of the best” and I wouldn’t care that much

          I wouldn’t turn my back on the women, even ones I was a fan of if they got signed by WWE. If SDR or whoever gets signed by the WWE I will be happy for them as it is what they want but I will be disappointed by how they are going to be treated in WWE

          No, I don’t think the women in the indys are better just because they’re in the indys. I think they’re better because they put on better matches than most of the “divas” and some are better than all of them in the ring.

          What I am saying is that most of the women in WWE are horrible. The women with wrestling backgrounds, Naomi, and maybe Maxine if she works more, are the only ones with ability

          Yeah, I know that SDR or some of the women getting signed would make no difference in their attitude with is exactly why I don’t want the women to get signed. I want to see them be allowed to put on good wrestling matches for the fans haha

        • GailKimFan09e

          Ummm are we forgetting two very special girls in our list of Best Divas…as in Aj and Kharma..

  • http://www.twitter.com/jillianhalltna JillianHallTNA

    OMG!!!!!!!! So true!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    Agree!!!!! I can’t wait to see that match!!!! :D

  • mariah.

    People will always have their opinions on the Divas and pick out who they think is better than who, but at the end of the day no one can tell me that these women don’t work hard to be where they are and NO ONE has the right to take that away from them. Same goes for any woman in any promotion.

    • thejoshifanx

      Well I respect the fact that they go out there, but what I have an issue with is that they are horrible in the ring. You can take actress, models, whatever and make them into wrestlers, like Hikaru Shida, Marti Belle, etc. and it works but when the women are horrible is the issue. I don’t think that they work hard because if they did then they could put on good matches.

      I also don’t care how much heart you have if you don’t put on good matches or at least improve a LOT. Like Makoto. She’s not the best in the ring, but she has a lot of heart, and has improved vastly over time, and she actually trains after passing the initial training unlike the divas.

      • GailKimFan09e

        though i agree with some of your views, I have to point out that when a person is given 2 minutes tops, I don’t care who you are there is no way you the match will go smoothly, that why i respect the current divas today though some of them aren’t on pare with most of the indy girls it isn’t entirely their fault that they aren’t given a chance to prove how good they are, or don’t have the right training when the very company you work for limits you and tells you to do only few moves, That’s why i my honest opinion i feel like the indy girls have it waaayy better then the divas and knockouts, because with a few rules they are pretty much free to perform their heart out and actually wrestle, where as the Divas or “model” who may have potential aren’t allowed to show this and are limited to 2 minutes.

    • Poison_Ivory

      Excactly! If a model has a true passion and desire of being a wrestler, why shouldn’t she chase her dream? Just because they were models doesn’t mean they can’t become great wrestlers. Unfortunately people way too easily think that and pass quick judgements. Hell, I was once like that too

      • 04bia

        trish and michelle mccool are prefect examples of this!

        • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

          Ugh Michelle McCool, how I adore that woman. She may have made me cringe during promo time, but my god, I LOVVVVVVVED watching her wrestle.

        • Melina&Mickie4ever!

          @04bia – Yes Michelle MCcool & Trish Stratus are perfect examples lol :)

      • thejoshifanx

        Well I agree, if a model wants to become a wrestler, if she is good in the ring then I accept her. It’s the ones that are horrible in the ring that I criticize.

        • Poison_Ivory

          It’s just too bad the few that actually don’t become great wrestlers are taken EVERYTIME as an example of female wrestling and model-turned-wrestlers.

        • thejoshifanx

          Exactly. When these women are in the mainstream spotlight, that’s what fans think of women’s wrestling. It’s one of the reasons I’m so anti “diva”. Women have to work 20 times as hard for 1/20th of the respect because of women like that, and they also are judged based upon their looks and not their talent a lot of the time. Sexualized.

          There are women out there that are models turned wrestlers, or who model after being a wrestler, which I’m fine with. Marti Belle was a model, Hikaru Shida was an actress, they’re both pretty talented. Those are just two examples. The thing is, WWE thinks that fans will like the models better, well I personally find women in the indys more attractive, and the only women on TV I like are Sofia Cortez and Sarita. Jessicka Havok > every woman in the world for damn sake haha. But also in WWE’s way of thinking, you can’t have women like Jessie McKay who look like divas and can wrestle, but they want to hire models and fail at attempting to turn them into wrestlers.

        • Crazy_J

          “When these women are in the mainstream spotlight, that’s what fans think of women’s wrestling. It’s one of the reasons I’m so anti “diva”. Women have to work 20 times as hard for 1/20th of the respect because of women like that”

          — You honestly think it’s Kelly Kelly, Eve, Alicia, etc’s fault because they signed a contract to make more than most of us would NEVER turn down? You think it’s their fault the WWE is promoting that image? No.. you’re making it sound like the diva’s have more power than they do, if Kelly or any of the others would’ve turned down a contract, the WWE would’ve just went and found another blonde bombshell because thats what they want, it isn’t the diva’s fault the WWE is promoting that “idea”, the diva’s are simply their pawns.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well I would turn it down in a heartbeat lol, I don’t care how much money they would give me. I want to become a wrestler, and I do not want to be in the WWE. I want to be a professional wrestler.

          Yes, I agree, WWE is the issue. They don’t care.

          What I am saying is that when WWE puts out a “divas” division like that, that is what most wrestling fans are going to think of women’s wrestling. Bikinis, booty shaking, fake boobs, photoshoots, hair pulling, screeching, horrible matches. Lots of people think that’s what women’s wrestling is which is one of the reasons I get so angry at WWE having the women they way they do. If they were some no name indy I would not care that much.

        • Raekon

          @TheJoshiFanX,
          good for you when you say you would turn down their offer.

          However, ask Del Ray or other top indy wrestlers if they would do the same.

          The answer would be NO cause its their dream to be in WWE no matter how bad the company is treating their women.

          Why? Because its the top wrestling promotion in the USA and opens the doors to any promotion around the world for a wrestler.

          Their promotions and exposure they give is top so most Indies strive to enter the WWE.

          Kharmas dream was the same, AJs dream was the same.
          They both compete in indy promotions, Kharma made a name in Japan and in TNA.

          Shouldn’t she had done that, they would turn her down again.

          The main reason they took her in was because they knew she will be a “cash cow” like Orton and Cena, not because they intented to give the divas division more to do.

          Alone this fact shows how vince mc mahon and john laurenaitis want the womens division to be.

          As about the tiring “models turned wrestlers” comparison AGAIN, Victoria was one too.

          That Michelle worked on her craft was great but the main reason she got more time and title runs and exposure was simply based to her relationships backstage and not on her skills(Sad but true).

          Would she have the skills only, they would had made another jobber out of her like they did with jillian and others.

  • Poison_Ivory

    I’m usually very anti-model and have never liked the model-become-wrestlers, but these girls do the very best they can with the resources given. Look at e.g Kelly, Eve and Layla. All former models/dancers and now they easily go as wrestlers. Not as the best wrestlers, but these ladies have to start somewhere. WWE is a bad example of female wrestling IMO.

  • Melina&Mickie4ever!

    In my opinion they all work hard but…in all honesty the models will never get as much respect as the “Wrestlers”do …. well accept Trish Stratus lol

    • perceval

      Isn’t Victoria/Tara highly respected, as well? Remember, she was a fitness model with no in ring experience when the WWF signed her.

      It was the Trish-Victoria feud from 2002-03 that took Women’s wrestling from the novelty it had always been (even in Moolah’s prime) to the upper card and a major draw in and of itself.

      The popularity of Women’s wrestling in North America, to where it can now support all female promotions like Shimmer, EVE, WSU, etc, came about because of those two former fitness models bringing the house down night after night in a series of classic, hard hitting, matches.

      • Melina&Mickie4ever!

        I know Tara did too but I was using trish since she is the most popular. I would have said Michelle also

        • perceval

          Michelle was a school teacher, though, not a model. We always hear about the “Model vs Wrestler” debate. Bring on the “School Teacher vs Wrestler” one!

          Well, I guess we’d need a few more School Teachers turned Wrestlers to do that. :)

  • 04bia

    i sorta agree with him not 100% tho. i also agree with @THEJOSHIFANX melina isnt the “best” there are more women who are better, but melinas good too dont get me wrong.
    i do feel wwe has alot of potential, you’ve got women like nattie and beth who are awesome no doubt, but are not treated well.
    yes we have some women in wwe who are not great wrestlers like rosa kelly etc. WWE hires women with looks rather than talent. if wwe bothered about talent they wouldnt have treated women like gail, melina, jillian, katie badly.
    but in this i dont blame the girls i blame more of wwe creative, they portray these women are “divas and pretty faces”. they book these girls in 2 sec matches and treat them like crap, so how are they supposed to showcase what they can do in 2 minute matches? no wonder fans lose interest.
    the divas are more than capable to deliver well if given the opportunities.

    look at last year, laycool vs nattie and beth in a tables match, even laycool/mickie feud, michelle/melina etc the list goes on. if wwe book right and give these divas time you get awesome stuff.

    • Crazy_J

      Once again he didn’t say Melina is the best. He said Jillian and Melina are the very best and he also compared them with Beth and Natalya. Like I stated before he isn’t going to say some name most people don’t know and say she’s the best or he’ll come off looking stupid because people will be like.. WHO!? How is she the best.. I don’t even know her.

      And I’m sorry but I’d rather watch Melina then whats gone on in the WWE the last 8 months..

      People need to realize WWE doesnt hire just wrestlers.. they hire entertainers, if you’re a good wrestler but you are bland, good luck getting a job. You need star quality and since WWE prevents a lot of people from doing a lot of moves they know, you need to shine personality wise that much more. I’m sorry but some of the women in the Indy’s just don’t have that quality. I’m not saying I like diva’s like Kelly, but I am saying she is there for a reason.

      • thejoshifanx

        I know you are not saying that about all indy women but I want to say something. There are tons of women with star quality

        The best example

        JESSICKA HAVOK

        You can’t look at that woman and tell me that she is not a star. She’s charismatic, funny, twisted, evil, a fantastic actress, and is a good wrestler to boot. Oh, and damn hot.

        While not everyone in the indys are like her, there are women in the indys that are as good or better than the divas and I think that WWE should realize that.

  • WWFoverWWE

    I wouldn’t say all of them can’t wrestle, but it is mostly true.

  • thejoshifanx

    So I’m bored so I have to add this random thought

    Arab / Hebrew / Persian women = hot

    (The guy is Iranian, it’s a valid comment!)

    • MomoMufFinSsFTW

      Ikr Btw am i the only one though who looked at the pic and thought ooohh sexy..then i clicked on it and saw his face and was like uhhh.noo thank you. <.<…just want to know

  • revivingophelia

    I’m sorry, but while reading his comments, I couldn’t help but think about the Melina vs. Jillian match for the divas title a couple of years ago on RAW, then compare it to Beth vs. Eve at Vengeance. I know which one I’d rather re-watch. Melina vs. Jillian was 24 seconds from bell to bell (I just watched it and kept an eye on the time) and would have lasted less time if the first move hadn’t been badly botched.

    Also, is he even familiar with the divas’ roster? Because he says everyone but Natalya and Beth were models. I don’t think AJ or Tamina were, and he seems to not realize that Kharma is part of the WWE.

    • thejoshifanx

      I think he doesn’t know the whole roster but that he means that the women without wrestling backgrounds are horrible, which besides Naomi is true

      • revivingophelia

        The point of the second part of my comment was that he clearly ISN’T familiar with the current roster. He’s making generalizations about them and bashing them as a way to promote what he’s doing now.

        • thejoshifanx

          Yeah I do think that he is trying to promote it. I mean, Melina the best in the world? Lol.

          But what I was saying is that I think that if he knew the current women in the WWE, he would say the ones without wrestling backgrounds (maybe Naomi) are horrible. But it’s not generalizations, the women without wrestling backgrounds (and Naomi) are horrible.

        • revivingophelia

          He’s making a sweeping statement encompassing all divas besides Nattie and Beth. That IS a generalization. He included every diva on the roster that isn’t named Beth or Nattie in his comment. He didn’t add exceptions, you did. I’m looking at HIS words, what he actually said, not what you think he would say.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well yes I know but like I said I’m sure he isn’t up to date on the WWE. If he was, he’d be able to see that there are other talented women.

          Even so, it’s sort of true because the other women, while decent, aren’t that great. Not counting FCW.

        • revivingophelia

          See… The first part of your comment right above is why I’m taking such an issue with what he’s saying. He doesn’t seem to be up to date with the current roster, so it’s not fair to call them all horrible when he doesn’t even know who is there right now.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well yeah I understand that he obviously isn’t up to date (because he said they were all models)

          Even so besides the wrestlers and Naomi (which he most likely would have said) they are horrible which is why I don’t have that much of an issue with the comment

        • revivingophelia

          Wow, you really go back and forth. You call them all (except Naomi) horrible again here, but two comments up you say that some of the other women are ‘decent’…. Which, you should know ‘decent’ does not = horrible. Those words are not synonyms. And in the thread below, you specifically refer to Eve and Alicia as ‘decent but not great.’ Once again, ‘decent but not great’ does not mean the same thing as ‘horrible’. ‘Decent’ is actually a synonym for ‘good’. But here… You called them all (besides Naomi) horrible again.

          Just pointing out that you haven’t been very consistent in what you’ve said.

          And on that note, I have better things to do today. So I’m out of here.

        • thejoshifanx

          Okay let me clarify then

          Wrestlers + Naomi = talented
          Eve = decent
          The rest = horrible

          When I said besides W+N that the women were horrible, I meant the current “divas”. When I said that some were decent, I meant Eve and women in the past.

          Not to mention, if you are on the largest stage of wrestling in the world decent = horrible. If you are just decent, then you should GTFO.

    • Crazy_J

      If you’re going to pick matches atleast pick matches that add up to one another.. you could’ve compared Jillian vs Melina to this weeks past Raw match Eve vs Beth, thats a better comparison and actually I was more into the Jillian vs Melina match considering it had suprise factor.

  • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

    I respect the women of the WWE for the simple fact that they have a goal and want to better themselves ring-wise, I honestly do (with the exception of Kelly and Rosa – you can visibly tell they are simply coasting along picking up paychecks and exposure, and have zero interest in perfecting their craft – i’m sorry but you would have to be either in denial or an ignorant sheep to not pick on that).

    I may not mark out when they wrestle, but at the end of the day I have nothing but respect for women like Eve, Alicia, Tamina, Maxine etc. for showing interest in their profession and a willingness to work on their craft. I don’t discriminate in terms of background (dancer, model, whatever the fuck you did in your past life, idc) as long as you show interest and passion, and most importantly IMPROVEMENT within a reasonable amount of time.

    HOWEVER, I would have already axed a good 75 percent of the divas locker room if it were up to me.

    • thejoshifanx

      Yes while I pick on the divas a lot, what I like is if they improve
      Naomi- I would have brushed her off because of her dancing background, but she has come around quite a way
      Maxine- Has fantastic mic skills, but looks to be improving in the ring too, and seems to have a passion for it

      To me Eve and Alicia are decent but not great. Just because you can do a couple moves does not mean anything.

      To me, most of the women are in the WWE because it’s the WWE. They pay a lot, you get to travel, you get on TV, and you get to add it to your resume. If a woman is young and then she still wrestles after leaving them, it is an indicator if she was just there for “fun”.

    • revivingophelia

      To me, Kelly only seems to work hard whenever it’s a pay per view. She seems to dial it in whenever she’s on RAW or SmackDown (well, aside from when she teamed with Edge on the SD main event last year). One thing I like about Eve is that she seems to always try to do the best she can with what they give her… Which isn’t always very much. She’s improved in the ring, she’s not afraid to take risks (like the super glamslam at Survivor Series) and she can actually cry on cue, which is apparently very necessary for her current story line.

    • mariah.

      Totally agree with you!

    • Lily

      !00% agree

  • dunk20

    They all offer something to the table. Some are great wrestlers, others have the mic skills others are just beautiful.

    Unfortunatly the problem is that WWE doesn’t care about their divas. Fans don’t give a rat’s ass as well, if fans cared it would be a different story. But ask the regular fan about diva’s and they only care if they are hot.

    • http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/WWE_Divas/ art

      my brother doesn’t really care about the divas looks at all i dont either..beth & nattie are basically the only ones he likes because they can actually wrestle…he likes the actual wrestlers…
      he does or has given layla & eve credit thou for their improvements but like him im sure theirs plenty of over 18 year olds who like the divas for their skill (which at the moment they dont get to show alot of) over their beauty….

    • thejoshifanx

      To me, indy women are hotter than the divas. In the WWE only Sofia is good looking to me haha.

      Jessicka Havok- hottest woman in the world
      Sara del Rey
      Natsumi Showzuki
      Blue Nikita

      The list goes on.
      I do like hot women in wrestling but skill is most important. If you’re a good wrestler, and not super disgusting to me in some way (sorry a good presentation matters), then I’m fine with that

      • http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/WWE_Divas/ art

        i find Beth attractive but i know she has alot more to offer then just her looks which is what i like…
        i think Layla is also good looking but shes got a tone of charisma & is decent in the ring & can work the mic…
        for me they have to be able to entertain me to me a good looking girl who cant do anything is just boring she has to be able to wrestle too…

        • thejoshifanx

          Exactly. You could put Aferdita Dreshaj in the WWE and I wouldn’t care if she couldn’t wrestle. To me, talent is the most important. I’m not going to lie, I enjoy when there are hot women who can wrestle though. Even so, I don’t find LuFisto, Mercedes Martinez, Zeuxis, Jenny Sjodin attractive but I still like watching them in the ring.

      • http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/WWE_Divas/ art

        i dont think michelle mccool was attractive but she was a good wrestler so i get your point…id rather have a mix because wrestling puriest would like the girls who can wrestle amazingly & theirs still some eye candy (but their decent wrestlers & learning)..

      • thejoshifanx

        Well I think that in the ring, say there are 14 women in the WWE. 10 are good looking and can wrestle, and 4 are okay or not that good looking and can wrestle. The models should be announcers/valets/mangagers/interviewers. It would please wrestling purists, people who like good looking women who can wrestle, and those who just want eye candy.

        • psykohurricane

          But do you think that with the current state of woman’s wrestling in mainstream company, that the indy’s girls are better off continuing to wrestles in the indy’s? The fact is, i love seeing woman’S like Sra del ray, Jessie McKay, Hamada and all the others woman’S like them wrestles, but that doesn’T means i would want to see them get disrespected in the WWE every week by being put in a 2-3 minutes match that means nothing except they need something to fill up time. The Divas division for me is perfect the way they are right now, You got the veteran wrestlers (Kharma, MAtalya, Beth Phoenix), you’ve got the real good ”Models”wrestlers that can put on a good match went they are ask to (Maxine, Eve, The Bella’S,Layla), you got the rooies that if train properly they could be good in a couple of years( Kaitlyn, AJ, most of the FCW girls) and you got the rest who should be wrestling but are there because of how they look. That what the WWE divas division was and always will be, a place were different type of models who have a passion for wrestling get together to fill a 2-3 minutes block of times on raw or smackdown. So why change that? Really, i don’T the division change direction because suddenly they got Sara Del Ray on the roster, so if i want great woman’S wrestling, i’m going to watch a dvd or go to a indy show, if i want to see decent woman’S wrestling i’m watching WWE or TNA.

        • thejoshifanx

          I never said that hiring indy women would fix things. It wouldn’t. What I want is their mindset to change and to have a legitimate wrestling division. You can still play the I-Want-To-Appeal-To-The-Fans card by having mostly attractive women who can wrestle, and then having some models do valeting and interviewing. The “divas” aren’t perfect because they are called divas, most of them are horrible, and they don’t put on good matches, minus the few times wrestlers get to face wrestlers.

  • http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/WWE_Divas/ art

    the only terrible or terriful (terrible+awful) women on the main roster is kelly that’s no secret to anyone & rosa mendes who’s valeting what women like her should be doing…
    the other girls have potential, are wrestlers or are abit sloppy at times like Alicia fox…
    it doesn’t matter if anyone of them were models,dancers whatever they can still become wrestlers…

    but i don’t see why that’s the reason the girls have less then one minute matches because stacy vs terri & matches like those with girls who weren’t the best wrestlers got more time still….theirs another reason its either vince isn’t interested in the womens division like the tag division &/or they cant do gimmick matches & have the women overtly sexual like they used to..
    another reason might be is they don’t want the women showing up the men…

    • thejoshifanx

      Yeah, WWE doesn’t care about the women. They are called divas for damn sake.
      I mean, they hire models because they think they are attractive, but don’t want a women’s division, you can tell. They’re only there because the shareholders would be upset if they got rid of them. One minute matches? Photoshoots? Booty shaking? Being called divas? Told not to outshine men? Etc.
      I personally would much rather see wrestlers called wrestlers and the occasional gimmick match, but if WWE doesn’t care, this is what we get.

      • http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/WWE_Divas/ art

        its like women in music/movies being called divas & so on…i don’t mind the girls being called “divas” if they weren’t presented the way they are,if they had strong personality’s & got to show what they can do i wouldn’t mind the term divas…
        i think the guys & girls need something to market their divisions so i don’t think just wrestlers would work marketing wise…we all know their wrestlers but i think they need a name…

        • thejoshifanx

          I have an issue with it. If they are wrestlers, then they should be called wrestlers. There is no other suitable name. I don’t want to watch the circus, I want to watch professional wrestling. You don’t have the athletes in football (soccer) be called superstars, or the women called divas, they’re called football players.

        • http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/WWE_Divas/ art

          yes but this is wwe,they are a brand,they have to get people hooked on not only the in-ring stuff but promotional & names like divas will hook people..i wouldnt mind another name for the girls,because wwe isnt going to sell the womens division being called women wrestlers…

        • thejoshifanx

          Why the hell not? Call them wrestlers, who cares? If WWE puts time and effort into a name, the fans will latch onto it. To a lot of people, the name divas is a turn OFF of the product. They can just call them wrestlers, because it is World WRESTLING entertainment.

        • http://au.groups.yahoo.com/group/WWE_Divas/ art

          im thinking business wise..wwe will not sell their product on calling the women or the men on calling them wrestlers because its also entertainment & their meant to be bigger then life & i dont think being called wrestlers would have that effect…
          id rather be called a wrestler over a diva if i was a girl but wwe is selling the womens division as divas as a whole..i dont know if they’ll call kharma a diva or not which would help her monster character….

        • thejoshifanx

          Like I said, WWE could sell it if they put effort into selling it. With them going into the so called “Realism Era” then calling them wrestlers would benefit them.

          “Divas” is demeaning. Bombshells, vixens, knockouts, all of it is horrible. WWE needs to stop being so scared ot the words “wrestling” and “wrestler/wresters”. The LEAST they could do is called the women superstars as well haha.

        • perceval

          @joshifanx

          “I have an issue with it. If they are wrestlers, then they should be called wrestlers. There is no other suitable name. I don’t want to watch the circus, I want to watch professional wrestling. You don’t have the athletes in football (soccer) be called superstars, or the women called divas, they’re called football players.”

          The Super Bowl match-up isn’t being listed as “New England Football Club vs New York Football Club.” It’s “New England Patriots vs New York Giants.” NFL teams make a lot of their money from franchising, logos, the brand names. “Superstars,” “Divas,” “Knockouts,” are brand names like “Patriots” and “Giants,” nothing more. So, we see “Superstars” and “Divas” in WWE for the same reason the Super Bowl isn’t featuring a team called “New York United.”

          “Divas” is simply a brand, a copyright, that worked nicely for titling magazines, videos, calendars, and the like, while preventing smaller promotions from calling THEIR women “Divas.” I use the term “smaller” rather than “indie” because ANY promotion not affiliated with the NWA is an indie. WWE just happens to be a really, really, BIG indie.

          “The LEAST they could do is called the women superstars as well haha.”

          They used to. To quote Trish Stratus a couple of months ago, “Now, it’s Superstars and Divas. We were Superstars.” The Women’s Division and the Divas had a lot of overlap, but they were still distinct. You had the eye candy and you had the Women’s Division. Some of the Women’s Division, like Trish, Lita, Ivory, Victoria, Mickie, Melina, & Beth would go with the eye candy to those exotic locations every year to do those photoshoots in bikinis and the like. You might find that demeaning, but THEY didn’t. After all, if Shawn Michaels could pose for Playgirl, why couldn’t Beth Phoenix pose in a bikini?

          People who don’t know her background actually assume Beth came to wrestling from fitness modelling, because her build is more fitness model than pure wrestler (Think Molly Holly), and she poses like a fitness model, even in her signature entrance. That’s why I didn’t understand folks here griping about her glamming it up in recent months, like it’s something new. That’s been her gimmick since 2007, the Glamazon, “the perfect combination of strength and beauty.”

          @art

          “.i dont know if they’ll call kharma a diva or not which would help her monster character”

          They do call her a Diva, actually.

        • thejoshifanx

          Okay I don’t like American football so I don’t give a damn about that. Even so, what do they call the players? Athletes, players, football players, footballers. They don’t have some cute made up name for them. I’m not talking about the teams, I’m talking about who makes up the teams.

          A brand? It’s fucking demeaning. They should be called WRESTLERS or at least superstars. Yeah and you can have eye candy just not in the ring, and then you can have mostly attractive women who can wrestle.

          Yeah, the photoshoots are demeaning because the superstars don’t have to do them. Basic attire photos, fine, but all those photoshoots are because the women are just there to look at.

          I don’t have an issue with models, I like models if they can wrestle.

        • thejoshifanx

          make*

        • perceval

          @joshifanx

          “Okay I don’t like American football so I don’t give a damn about that.”

          OK then, it’s the same with the NBA, MLB, NHL, every professional sport in North America. These are businesses, so they want to make money. Where do you think WWE got a lot of the ideas for how they market their product?

          The NBA, in turn, has found inspiration in WWE with elaborate entrances, including entrance themes and pyro.

          Individual players are called football players, basketball players, etc, just as individual pro wrestlers are called pro wrestlers. If you play for New England’s football franchise, you’re a Patriot. If you wrestle for WWE’s wrestling franchise, you’re a Superstar.

          Oh, BTW, good looks and sex appeal had a LOT to do with the rises of Shawn Machaels, the Rock, the young Ric Flair, Hulk Hogan, and, going way back, Lou Thesz. It wasn’t just Thesz’s talent that made him THE guy for the post-WW II pro wresting era, but promoters deciding his good looks would appeal to the female demographic. What was the Hardyz fan base? Teen girls who thought the Hardyz were hot. Notice it’s always guys booing Cena, never the women. And, surely you’ve noticed that the guys, for the most part, show a LOT more skin than the women? And, again, why aren’t you complaining about how demeaning it was for Shawn Michaels to pose for Playgirl?

          During the Golden Era, all the Divas weren’t wrestlers. Your pure eye candy types like Stacy Kiebler had enough ability to work a few matches here and there, but she was mainly there for other things than wrestling. Also, the women wrestlers didn’t HAVE to do the photoshoots. Some of them chose not to. Molly wasn’t comfortable with it. Trish, Lita, Ivory, Victoria, Mickie, Melina, & Beth were. And frankly, as hard as they worked on their bodies, I don’t hold their willingness to show them off against them. They earned the right to a little vanity.

          No, the problem was giving the Divas Championship to the pure eye candy. During the Golden Era, Maryse & Kelly would never have held the Women’s Championship.

        • thejoshifanx

          -They should either be called wrestlers or superstars, not something demeaning like divas. You don’t see female football (soccer) players being called divas, they’re football players. Football is the top sport in the world.
          -Yeah good looks/sex appeal has a lot to do with it. I said they should have say, 10 women who are good looking/sexy to most and can wrestle, and 4 women who are okay/not that good looking and can wrestle, and then have models as announcers, interviewers, and valets too.
          -There are hot women who can wrestle.
          -I”d take Jessicka Havok over any woman in the WWE. But even so, I’d rather have Jenny Sjodin or Mercedes Martinez in the WWE than the “divas” because wrestling is the most important to me. If I want to watch hot women, I’ll go watch lingerie modeling shows or porn.

          If a guy poses for Playgirl, it’s not that demeaning because
          1. Mostly men read it
          2. It’s only one instance and doesn’t happen all the time

          Nowadays ALL THE WOMEN do photoshoots and the men don’t. The only photoshoots I support are new attires or championships or looks.

          If someone wants to see hot women, there are things that cater to that. Wrestling does not equal porn.

    • LadyGoDiva

      Thats the sad part because if the WWE isn’t doing so well with their main event superstars they can invest their time and have a few tag team and divas involved in the raw/sd main event card once in a while.

      I understand why people don’t like the term “diva” or “knockout” but some of the women in wwe or tna have that Diva or Knockout personality.

      • thejoshifanx

        Because if they are wrestlers, then they should be called wrestlers. Diva, knockout, etc is demeaning. Like I said, if the WWE doesn’t want to say wrestlers and calls their men superstars, they could at least call their women the same.

        Take a look at Jessie McKay. She has a diva personality, but she’s a wrestler, it would be an insult to call her less.

        • Crazy_J

          Actually.. they don’t call Kharma a diva.. atleast they haven’t since they’ve been talking about her return at the rumble.

        • thejoshifanx

          They call every one of their women divas at some point or another. If someone is not called one than it would be a step forward in the right direction.

  • Mr. Asstastic

    Oh, for a second I thought it would be someone who mattered. Oop.

    • dunk20

      It would be more valuable if it was stated by someone with more status?
      Biased much?

    • revivingophelia

      *laughs*

      I kind of had that reaction when I saw who it was, too.

    • mariah.

      LMFAO, yes!!!!!! I’m not going to lie, I totally had the exact same reaction.

      • dunk20

        Typical type of people. There are does who lead and does who are led. You are all clearly on the second group. If it was someone more important would the words change?

        • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

          …..

        • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

          PS. “does” is not a synonym for “those”

          just sayin’

        • dunk20

          It was a typo. English is not my first language so I think I won’t go to jail If I make some small understandable mistakes like that.
          We can write in another language if you want though. But you probably stick to the only one you know.
          Just saying.
          Cabra.

        • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

          First off, I’m sorry you get incredibly uptight/antsy over a simple grammar correction.

          Second off, the “This is my first language therefore there is some leeway with what i say + I struggle with english due to the fact that i know more than one language, how about you?” card stopped working for quite some time now.

        • mariah.

          LOL well I’m sorry, but I thought this comment was funny. I guess that makes me a follower. Get over yourself.

    • Belize

      MR.ASSTASTIC: “Oh, for a second I thought it would be someone who mattered. Oop.”

      LOL. I thought the same thing the first time I saw your comment.

      Of course you’re going to react like that since it makes your precious Kelly Kelly look bad. Sadly, I’m 90 percent sure that had he said something that conforms to your views, you’d be praising him. Evidences are in past comments. Wow, you’re LIKE so easy.

      @TERI: I love how you make it seem as though your correction has any bearing on his point. Shallow much?

  • Joshi Rules

    I just wish the WWE was all about bringing in the BEST women’s wrestlers in the world and give them the opportunity to shine, like the way most other competent businesses are run. Instead the WWE takes models that have the looks they want and give them a bit of training. Sure a few of them have the ability to develop into competent wrestlers who can put on a passable 5-6 minute match every now and then, but they pale in comparison to the Sara Del Reys of the world, who routinely put on 15-20+ minute matches against the best in the world.

    Until the WWE rewards ability and changes it’s philosophy to that of promoting the BEST women’s wrestlers in the world, I will have little respect for the Diva’s division.

    • dunk20

      I prefer to watch good looking people pretending to fight then ugly and ordinary ones who pretend to fight. If you prefer the actual sport instead of the entertaining why don’t you go watch MMA instead? The fighting is real so you can easily see who is indeed good.

      • thejoshifanx

        Well there are a lot of good looking women in the indys and Japan. Not every woman has to be good looking though.

        We also want to see “fake fighting” but good performances. I would rather watch a good movie than a D-List-straight-to-the-discount-bin-DVD-that-was-done-cheap-movie.

      • French.One

        Nonsense, if you care that much about the look watch gossip girl and all CW programing.

        • mariah.

          You’d be surprised how many unattractive people are on the CW :P

    • thejoshifanx

      :D This!!!!

      I want the women to
      -Be hired based on their talent first
      -Be proportionally women that are good looking and can wrestle and some who can just wrestle
      -Have plenty of TV time
      -Have thought into their storylines
      -Have gimmicks
      -Have good themes
      -Not be told not to outshine the men
      -Be able to compete in more gimmick matches
      -Be treated fairly and at least on the level of the Intercontinal/United States Championship divisions

      Seriously, and they think it’s about looks when a bunch of indy women are hotter than the divas (and can wrestle too!).

      • dunk20

        I agree with that. But maybe that’s why you prefer the indys. They have all that less the mainstream exposure.

        • thejoshifanx

          Exactly. There are a few things though
          1. I think that the largest professional wrestling company in the world should have the best wrestling in the world and should be held to a higher standard
          2. The indys don’t have as much wrestling as the WWE
          3. It’s harder to find women’s wrestling in the indys. Sure, I’ll buy SHIMMER, NCW FF, WSU, CHIKARA, but to have to pay $15 for DVDs from some companies just to watch one match is ridiculous. Not to mention outside of SMASH it’s almost impossible to find joshi online
          4. In this economy, people don’t have a lot of money to spend around and there needs to be more free good wrestling for people to watch

    • French.One

      just read cryssis review of last monday night raw, you’ll see there is a bunch of people who are not that interested in wrestling.

      • thejoshifanx

        Exactly. The only watch WWE for the entertainment part and they don’t care about wrestling.

        • Jhonmarco

          I liked Raw & didn’t care that the match was under a minute. I care about wrestling, I support Shimmer, WSU, etc. please don’t label people.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well if you didn’t care that the match was under a minute all I can do is shake my head. If you consistently enjoy the way the “divas” are treated and you enjoy watching the “divas” (not wrestlers) attempt to wrestle, then that is not being a wrestling fan. (I’m not talking about the women that were on RAW I am saying in general).

        • Jhonmarco

          I said I liked RAW, because it had 2 great matches & good storyline progression. Beth/Eve was acceptable to put Beth over as dominant & Eve as not being mentally ready to go. Sorry, I missed the memo where you decide what makes me a wrestling fan? Oh, that’s right you don’t. Stop trying to put people down for being positive & just quit watching as you obiviously hate the product.

        • thejoshifanx

          Okay I can deal with five minute matches maybe considering their mindset, but thirty seconds? Unacceptable. What does it say about a former champion that she can be beat in 30 seconds? That she’s weak. It could have at least lasted a few minutes.

          EVERY week it’s two minutes at the most, now lately it’s one, or even less, MAYBE a four minute match on Superstars. It’s unacceptable. But then, hey, most of the women can’t carry a match longer.

          I’m sorry if I came across that way, but I meant if that’s the ONLY stuff you like then you are not a wrestling fan. If you seek out alternatives, then fine.

          I still watch because so I know what I’m talking about and am up to date on the women, but I’m still going to be upset about how they are treated.

        • Jhonmarco

          I obiviously do seek out alternatives & so do others. You wouldn’t know because they don’t troll the site with their indy comments. I wouldn’t watch something, I despise like you do with WWE. It’s nonsense & makes you seem idiotic for critizing them & continue to watch. Notice, I said this week it was fine as it made Beth look dominant. A few minutes would have been fine, but the match did what it was supposed to do.

        • thejoshifanx

          No, I’m sure you and others do, but some don’t.

          The only reason I watch is so I know what the hell is going on when I talk about it. But the reason I get so upset is because I love professional wrestling, and women’s professional wrestling, and they are making a mockery out of it, and it makes me sad. I believe that the largest wrestling company in the world should have the best wrestling.

          My gripe with the match is that it made Eve look horrible. So you’re going to expect me to believe she could compete for the championship now? No. They could have at least used someone like Alicia Fox who is a twig.

        • Jhonmarco

          Key word: some. If they don’t, that’s their choice who are you to push your indy wrestling on them. By making commenst about the indies as much as you do, you come off as someone who pushes what you like down people’s throats. Eve wasn’t mentally prepared for the match & it made sense, besides quick squashes are gonna rebuild Beth for Kharma. Besides Eve doesn’t stand a chance against Kharma so she doesn’t need to wrestled with Beth for a 20 minute clinic.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well I’m not trying to push it down people’s throats. I just voice my opinion because it’s what I’m passionate about. I love wrestling and hate when it’s made a mockery of. I, like most people, want a legitimate women’s division.

          I never said the divas matches had to be twenty minutes long but five would have been enough.

        • French.One

          @Jhonmarco : as much as the quick segment made (arguably) sense yesterday, we know it was just another cheap excuse for another short diva match.
          I personally don’t give a crap about storylines, and I find it odd some people are pleased with the last monday night raw without arguing that from a diva in-ring perspective it’s till the same crap.

          @thejoshifanx : relax ;)

        • thejoshifanx

          I am sorry, I just am extremely passionate about wrestling like I said, (not to mention, I want to become a wrestler as soon as I can, I just need the money) I’m one of those people that at soccer games are yelling at the players, swearing, starting chants, screaming, etc. I’m very vocal, and that’s why I come across as so crazy haha.

        • mariah.

          I’m with you @JhonMarco.

  • shameronstar

    Considering most of the divas are still very inexperienced in comparison to many popular indy talent I don’t think it’s a fair comparison. That’s like saying someone who just came out of school for something in a particular field sucks in comparison to a person in the same field who has been doing it for 10 years. Well of course, in most cases, that the greenhorn isn’t going to be as good as the seasoned veteran. Not to mention indy talent wrestle people from all kinds of places like Mexico, Japan, Europe, and etc. so they can learn a much wider range of things in-comparison to a model, dancer, bodybuilder, or football player who only learns from FCW, which is good for learning basics, but lacks seasoning of international experience so their growth usually is limited. I think it’s like comparing apples to oranges, both have different flavors, but saying one is better than the other is opinion not fact. I usually change my inner quality calibrator differently depending on who I’m watching. For example, I set people like Kelly and the Bellas to a low setting, Eve and Alicia to a medium setting, people like Beth and Natalya to a high setting, and for people who I’ve seen like Sarita or Hamada or Sara Del Rey I set to the highest setting because they have vast indy experience thus they’ve been exposed to the most to learn from. I just think you got to keep everything in perspective and realize not everyone is equal.

    • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

      100% agreed with everything you just said.

  • LadyGoDiva

    You know that WWE isn’t doing their job when you have several of your former WWE superstars/divas say that you women’s division sucks and its true theres no hiding it.

    But most of what Shawn Daviri said about the models can’t wrestle, I can think of a few at the top of my head. Michelle McCool, Tara, Trish,etc. But if they sing a few indy women in the roster I would only hope that it would help the division improve.

  • thejoshifanx

    Well you have people saying that you shouldn’t compare the “divas” to indy women, well what I am saying is that the “divas” should not be on TV. If you can’t wrestle, you shouldn’t be in the largest wrestling company in the world. Leave valeting/managing for the “divas”. What my issue is- women should be hired based on their talent first, called wrestlers, and have a legitimate division- I’m sick of seeing women who can’t work on TV.

    • thejoshifanx

      To add to that, it’s like if you picked models out of a catalog and told them to get onto the football (soccer) field and play games with two months of training and no prior football experience. I don’t think that any sane football fan would want to watch that.

  • jayjayholler

    Never had an opinion on Daviri until now – very wise and perspective man.

  • thejoshifanx

    Lol I just noticed something

    Match of the Year?

    I’m sorry I have to laugh.

    Ayako Hamada & Ayumi Kurihara vs Hiroyo Matsumoto & Misaki Ohata, Jessicka Havok vs Mercedes Martinez, LuFisto vs Jessicka Havok?, SDR’s matches, SHIMMER matches, they all say hello :)

    • Jhonmarco

      Couldn’t help yourself with the indy references, huh?

      • Melina&Mickie4ever!

        @JohnMarco – LMAO! I was waiting for you to comment….

    • thejoshifanx

      Well all I’m doing is making a god damn comment. Those women put on better matches than any other women in the business. If you don’t like my comments then don’t fucking read them. Haha.

      • Jhonmarco

        And people don’t that these women are the best? You can relaxe your wrestling purist ass down, no need to use cuss words. And you make the same comment over & over, & you fill up half the comments complaining about WWE/TNA. If you hate them so much, why do you talk about them?

        • Crazy_J

          lol@ You can relaxe your wrestling purist ass down

        • thejoshifanx

          @Crazy If that was directed towards me like I said you do not have to read my opinions

      • thejoshifanx

        First of all, I’m an adult, I can swear if I want to, last time I checked as long as I don’t use the c or n words it’s fine. I talk about indies so much because I can. Why do people talk about past women in WWE so much? Because they can. I’m sick of them talking about “Bring this diva back” “I miss this diva” etc. Listen, all I was doing was making a comment because he said that their match would be the best match of the year, while it might be decent, it’s not going to be.

        • Jhonmarco

          I never said you couldn’t sware, I said it’s not necessary or needed. So people talking about former WWE women has to do with what? They don’t comment on topics about former wwe women when that’s not what the topic is about. Oh so this is the reason you talked about the indies? BS, you would’ve mentioned them either way & for an adult your indy trolling makes you look like a child. Grow up.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well I like to swear :P

          Lots of times people mention past divas in topics about current divas

          Well hey guess what? Find me an indy forum that updates frequently and I’ll stop being on WWE topics so much

          Dude all I did I say that these WOMEN WHO ARE NOT IN WWE aren’t going to have a match compared to the other women. Okay, Serena Deeb will have a better match then them. I hope you are happy now

        • Jhonmarco

          This is just about the first time you posted a cuss word. That’s at least somewhat relvant, SDR is no way relvant to WWE. Things like this that you mention 24/7. There are plenty of forums for indies that don’t update frequently. Why do you need that though? The shimmer forum gets updates daily by users. And dude you say that all the time. It’s pretty damn annoying & like someone said before it comes off as you trying to push your views on people.

        • thejoshifanx

          Show me one forum that has frequent activity about the indys. I like to talk about wrestling a lot and don’t want to wait a day or days for a post

          I never said SDR was relevant. What I said is that those women would have better matches than women WHO ARE NOT IN THE WWE

          SHIMMER is only about SHIMMER. It only has a few updates a day too. I also don’t like that creepy fan on there.
          I like other promotions as well

          No, if I was pushing my views, I would say F*ck the divas!!!! They are (c-word)s!!!!! Whores! Sluts! They’re all hacks!!!!! *rage face* I have some positive things to say about the divas. I can admit that the ones who have talent have it.

          Hey, like I said, people talk about past divas a lot. I don’t see how it’s any different to indy women. Neither are relevant to current WWE.

        • Jhonmarco

          So you come on a site dubbed “Diva Dirt”? Smart choice. You don’t have to push your views by cussing, but by mentioning the same thing all the time. & you do & put down others opinions. And yes a creepy fan, kinda like diva dirt has one.

        • thejoshifanx

          It’s still the “Women’s Wrestling Bible”

          How the hell am I creepy? Because I love wrestling?
          I don’t want to order cardboard cutouts of the women or be obsessed with buying them stuff or have dumb catchphrases like him. Sure, I think some women are hot, but I don’t stalk them or whatever. I just love the sport.

          Well hey I swear a lot, that’s me, I’m sorry. Think of me as a certain indy wrestler who I won’t name ;).

          Well I guess it’s my gimmick. I can be the #heel of Diva Dirt :P. Unless WWE changes or blatantly says that they won’t I’m still going to act this way because I love wrestling.

          I apologize for insulting you, I just get angry with how mainstream women are treated and I tend to take it out on the fans of those women. Hey, it’s what you’re given, you can’t help that. I tend to have no issue with fans who like wrestling too, the only fans I have an issue with are
          1. Ones who complain about the women but do NOT seek alternatives too
          2. Ones who think that the divas are better than other women just because they are in WWE

          I’d like to not have an issue with us though because you are fine haha :)

        • Jhonmarco

          Anyone who’s visited this site know it’s mainly about the divas. I can agree with you that the divas division is crap & needs a reboot. I agree that some of the girls on the indies need to be in WWE, but it’s no one’s fault but WWE’s for people thinking Kelly is the best. She’s with the biggest wrestling company in the world, so it’s pretty easy to assume that. I aplogize for insulting you, I just can’t stand trolling. I do admire your passion for wrestling & for women like Havok & Del Rey. I just really get annoyed by trolling as I said.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well I’m not trying to troll. I’m just super passionate about wrestling and I’m very vocal, so it might come off that way

          Yeah, the reason I get so angry is because of them being the largest wrestling company of the word, and not having the best wrestling out there. If some indy company had “divas” I wouldn’t care

          Well I am going to nice to you since you are sensible and to other sensible people. but the minute someone says “Since (x) isn’t in WWE then she must not be talented” “Divas are the best in ring performers” etc then I won’t be so even tempered

          Oh I dream of the day that WWE has a legitimate division with all those indy women. Jessicka and Sara on TV? O_O :D

          I shall try to be nicer from now on and not mention the indys so much but it will take time haha

        • Jhonmarco

          Havok not being on tv should be a crime! I apoligize again for coming off rude, I commend your passion though :).

        • thejoshifanx

          Thank you! Now I need to turn that into a gimmick when I become a wrestler. >:)

          I would LOVE for Jessicka Havok to be on TV. Hottest woman ever, amazing acting and mic skills, good wrestler, the total package!

          I should start my own wrestling promotion like I want to and convince her to join it. She’d be one of the top stars.

          I think that it would super cool if she would go to Japan full time in a couple of years and come back to the US for SHIMMER, NCW, some WSU events. She’d thrive there with her size and style.

  • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

    Oh, and I forgot to add…..

    when someone says that Melina is the ‘best’ womens wrestler in today’s womens wrestling landscape, you automatically KNOW that they have a very small scope of well, womens wrestling. So to answer Dunk’s question in this thread (scroll up), YES, the ‘words would have changed’ if it was someone who was more informed/womens wrestling cultured than fucking Daivari.

    • thejoshifanx

      Well I think that he’s just trying to promote the show, I don’t think he actually believes that. I would rather have someone say that Melina is the best than Kelly Kelly though haha.

      • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

        “I would rather have someone say that Melina is the best than Kelly Kelly though haha”

        The day someone makes a solid statement that Kelly Kelly is one of the best wrestlers in the world is the day I get put away for murder.

        • thejoshifanx

          It happened I think a few months ago maybe?

          Someone was like “lol i dont know how sarah del ray is. ive never heard of her” and said Kelly Kelly was the best. I think it was this site.

        • thejoshifanx

          Well sadly people do think that Kelly Kelly and other “divas” are the best in the world. Alicia Fox, Eve, Kaitlyn, etc. There are also people, sometime the same ones, who think that because a woman isn’t in the WWE that means she isn’t good. Sad.

    • dunk20

      Quoting: “They’re the very best at what they do and they happen to be beautiful.”

      Teri, although I am really inclined to insult your ignorance I’ll try to be polite. You correct a grammar mistake but you are prone enough to missunderstand a simple comment made by someone. Daivari clearly says that Melina is the very best at what she does. It could be cooking, cleaning even driving. In this case we know it’s wrestling. She is the best at what she do but it doesn’t mean he is saying she is the best in the world.

      And once again, wrestling is subjective. It’s all a matter of opinion when it comes to consider who the best is. You do know wrestling is fake right?

      • KidKamikaze

        “And once again, wrestling is subjective. It’s all a matter of opinion when it comes to consider who the best is. You do know wrestling is fake right?”

        Frankly, this type of thinking not only ignores the concept of art theory and criticism, but it’s also pretty insulting to the performers. Especially the ones who put in the effort, and have gained the approval of the audience, critics, and especially their peers.

        • dunk20

          That’s funny considering that Kelly Kelly is know the diva who gets the biggest pop in the company when it comes to divas.
          Don’t get me wrong, I also prefer the real wrestlers over the models but it’s still subjective.

          Hulk Hogan and John Cena are shitty wrestlers and they still are the face of the company. The same goes to divas like Kelly. It’s entertainment. The best wrestler will be the one with the best script. Just like soap operas.

          I remember the time when -not so long ago- when almost everyone here in diva dirt were against Eve, and there where like 4 fans who liked her. I always said she was a diamond in the making and everyone laughed about it. Now everybody loves her.

          It’s how it goes. Wrestling is scripted, they will make you love who they want you to love.

          Maxine? She is great. She is having exposure like hell. That’s why people can’t stop saying now she is awesome.

          You all have a one way oriented mind. And that’s sad.

        • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

          @ DUNK20

          How exactly does KidKamikaze have a “one way oriented mind”? I’m quite curious for your rationale behind that. Perhaps your rationale is none other than “people who do not share my views and way of thinking are ignorant”?

      • http://www.youtube.com/users/RingVixens Teri

        I invite you to re-read the first portion of Daivari’s statement:

        “They’re the very best in women’s wrestling today”

        In addition to that, all other additives such as “in the world” are irrelevant at this point, considering he has already made quite the definitive statement with “They’re the very best in women’s wrestling today”.

  • numero47

    I think because WWE is the biggest wrestling promoter in the world there is this mentality that it is the greatest.
    Of course we can see based on the Women’s division that isn’t true. I have always been against calling women like Beth/Natalya/Kharma “Divas” because they are wrestlers who have proven outside of WWE that they can work in the ring.
    As for the model-turn-wrestler debate I will say that we have seen some examples of it being possible (e.g Tara, Trish, Candice) but when someone isn’t good they just aren’t good!

  • bromero329

    i dont think EVE is awful . shes pretty good to mr.she can give us good matches. maxine is good but shes a little slow.

    everyone else is just boring

    exsept beth kharma natalya and aj

    • thejoshifanx

      Yes those are the only women that are fine in the WWE, then if you add in Naomi, Sofia, and Taya from FCW.

      • KidKamikaze

        Don’t forget Saraya/Britani.

      • thejoshifanx

        Oh sorry forgot about her. Not a fan but she is talented.

      • bromero329

        i havent really payed attention to sofia and taya. im talkin about main roster divas. not fcw divas. i see them as normal wrestlers when i see fcw. maybe tis me but kind of boring. exsept that last pole match

  • A.E

    he is sooo right the majority of models are awful no doubt about it girls like kelly and rosa ect don’t belong not to mention they gave woman wrestling a bad name to began with girls like trish or michelle who were in wwe with zero experience like them look who far they achieved those girls simply don’t belong wrestling ring .

  • MadisonMaryse

    roflmfao talk about overrating.. jeez.. Melina sucks and while I like Jillian, best in the world not quite.

    • dunk20

      Funny thing about a human speech is that you don’t need to take every word in a literal way.

      It’s like if you say you have the best mother in the whole world. Ofcourse you don’t, but still she will still be the best for you, so why do you have to take daivari’s comment literally?

  • KidKamikaze

    As for Shawn’s comments, he’s generalizing, but I don’t expect him to be up-to-date. Like most do, I think he’s overrating Melina, but hey, he’s selling the product.

    But yeah, I think we women’s wrestling fans do need to up our standards a bit. And of course, search and support the gold standard, which isn’t in the mainstream (won’t be anytime soon).